/pco/ - Promotions

Welcome to /pco/ - Promotions. This board is for sexual material of a western nature. Please read the rules before posting:

Content not allowed: guro, scat, bestiality.
1) Content must fall into one of the following categories:
1a) Western properties (for ex.: Marvel, Mass Effect, Wakfu)
1b) Properties with a large Western interpretation (for ex.: Transformers, Sonic the Hedgehog)
1c) Original Content in Western "style" (for ex.: Ganassa, Kyhu, Owler)
1d) non-Western properties by artists predominantly known for Western art or style (for ex. artist generals or art dump threads)
2) Lesbian and Straight-shota are considered /pco/ material
3) Due to the nature of Western material, furry is allowed on all promotion boards!
4) FUTANARI/DICKGIRLS ARE /cod/ MATERIAL

DO NOT POST LIST
- MILFToon
- Jab Comix
- John Persons (The Pitt, etc)
- BannaGalactic
- Slipshine (and related sites)

Posting content from any of these will be a week's ban for first offense.

File allowance: 8MB jpg, 12MB png, 8MB gif, 16MB swf, 16MB webm, 16MB mp4, 8MB mp3

Thread stats: 386 posts, 165 files (165 image(s))

Toggle poster info Replying to /pco/164663 Close window
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Replies:>>167798
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For the new board.
No.164674
Anonymous
whoah..
No.164711
Anonymous
Noice
No.164713
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
has he appeared again?
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That Madison is an old pic. The newest I've seen from his is this from a "Loud House" thread a few days ago.

I wish he'd upload the Minnie Mouse and Smurfette stuff he made in Picarto.
No.164718
Anonymous
Replies:>>164727
Cute shota!
No.164727
Anonymous
>>164718 sorry mate but "shota " involves sex , all of i can see is a bunch of dancing
No.164728
Anonymous
>>164727

Actually shota doesn't always involve sex, just cuteness in which I see in the picture. Lol

I just watch the preview... I hope it loves up to its hype
No.164732
Anonymous
>>164727 for that arguments later will see a "ink beings rights" and the censorship will won, better be explicit to make the (porn) point clear, so who offers voluntary for a blood sacrifice to summon simon again?
No.164733
Anonymous
>>164727 well thats is a spiky area....its like if a real person saying curses against jesus, but if it says an animated character its funny
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new from conoghi
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Just saw these in a eurocomic thread.
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No.164881
Anonymous
Replies:>>164894
If only there was a way to better track his art. Imagine all those lost pieces...heck, there isn't even a good place for him to put his rule34 stuff. If only he'd get a Hentai Foundry account.
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>>164881
He'll come back. He always does.
No.164899
Anonymous
penny peterson hhnngg >_<
Replies:>>164915
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Agnes...
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>>164907 dont post shitte
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I don't know where he'd post his lewd stuff if he was so inclined.
Replies:>>164923
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No.164922
Anonymous
>>164921

Not even gonna front... That's adorable
No.164923
Anonymous
>>164920
>>164921

It's interesting to see his Pixivchat drawings next to his Sai drawings. Those lines are so sharp and controlled. I guess Pixivchat was like training with a handicap and concealing his power level.
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That's it, Tino. Take it all off...
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Replies:>>164945
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Come on Tino, almost there...
No.164945
Anonymous
Replies:>>164947
>>164943

I'm not even gay but he do need to do more males
No.164946
Anonymous
You mean because his male characters don't look like skeletons? :P
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>>164945
>implying you have to be gay to appreciate cute boys
No.164954
Anonymous
>>164947

See now that is lovely!
No.164960
Anonymous
>>164947
You're right, you don't have to be gay.
Just a pedophile.
No.164964
Anonymous
Replies:>>164977
>>164960
If this is what you want to hear: Yes.

Happy?
No.164974
Anonymous
>>164960

You sound like the guy who went in his Picarto and kept asking for Amy Gillis porn.
No.164977
Anonymous
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Replies:>>165065
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Replies:>>165020
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No.165020
Anonymous
>>165017

More of them?
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That's it for the new stuff, and we might not get more for a while. I could post his older pics, but they're just dupes of the stuff posted on the old board.
No.165065
Anonymous
>>165004
Dino Time art? In 2014?
I'm not sure if want to laugh or cry.
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No.165353
Anonymous
Replies:>>165371
>>165346
Interesting how he draws her from any perspective. It is like he can create her in 3D inside his mind and simply rotate it as he wish.
No.165371
Anonymous
Replies:>>165378
>>165353
Yeah, that's what he means when he talks about basic construction in the discussions he has about drawing theory. If you understand the forms that make up a figure, you should be able to draw it in any perspective relatively easy. Although there are some perspectives you would avoid, less because you CAN'T draw it, and more because it creates a weak or hard to read silhouette.
No.165378
Anonymous
>>165371
Well, if you can do this as an artist, you're really good. And it's not "relatively easy" unless you got the talent for it. I've drawn for 20 years now and I still fuck up a basic, flat image.
No.165380
Anonymous
>>165378
It's nothing special, it's part of any academic drawing books and school program. Lots of people on the internet don't do it, though, since people tends to only work the part they want to draw, and it's usually just pinups.
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>>165380
Not just the internet.

Seems like tons of western cartoons almost never do any bold camera angles.
No.165383
Anonymous
>>165378
One recommendation I can give you that really helped me? Try doing some 3D Modelling. You don't really need to become a master at it or anything, but trying to sculpt something in a 3D program really helped me, both in understanding the 3D forms of different things, and in terms of anatomy--if you ever try to do any skin weight rigging, for example, you almost have to learn the musculature under the body just to make the deforms look right.
No.165384
Anonymous
>>165380
Well, I for my part just gave up to try drawing great and instead use the Canadian "everyone's celebrating it on tumblr and /b/ even though its incredibly lazy doodling with funny faces, egg shaped eyes and V-form mouth just make the lines dark blue and shade it light blue and its insta-artsy" style now. What can I say, it works. Everyone can do it.
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No.165463
Anonymous
>>165454
>>165455
God dammit simon this is why i keep coming back.
No.165537
Anonymous
Bump
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Something I found while browsing 4chan, I think a lot of Simons work gets lost in there
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>>165542

I think I have most of his pics, but I don't post them all because they're not always porn. But I post when I think it's cute or sexy or related to art discussions.

He's browsing the Jimmy Neutron thread right now.
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...and Molly from the FoP thread.
Replies:>>165574
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>>165542
Seeing as he doesn't have (or want?) a permanent gallery anywhere anymore, that's probably why just he posts most of his stuff randomly in different threads:
You want it? Gotta catch it while you can...
Replies:>>165576
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>>165570

He clearly prefers cartoon and nostalgia threads, so it's not completely random.
No.165576
Anonymous
Replies:>>165577
>>165574
Obviously, but there's never a guarantee of which one. You could spend all you're time keeping an eye on a Weekenders or Ed, Edd 'n' Eddy thread and then he'll post something in a Randy Cunningham thread that you failed to pay attention to.
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>>165576
I think that's what makes the Simon pics so special, it's like finding treasure on the internet, and every once and a while someone might share their booty in places like this.
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Replies:>>165728
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Just a little present for all you simon fans.. I'm coloring this piece.
No.165717
Anonymous
awww yus delicious Kit
Cheers!
No.165728
Anonymous
Replies:>>165732
>>165712

0/10 Her underwear was blue, if my memory serves.
No.165730
Anonymous
>>165380

You sound really smug and confident in what you're saying. Why don't you show us what your drawings look like, pal?
No.165732
Anonymous
>>165728
She also has a thong style in this pic, rather then kiddie undies in the show.
Replies:>>165742
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Replies:>>165739
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Anyone have the full version of this? I don't recall it being posted here.
No.165742
Anonymous
>>165733
what show re they from?
No.165757
Anonymous
>>165742
It's in the filename.
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>>165742

Megan Bacon from Fairly Oddparents. There's an FOP thread on the other chan right now that he's posting in.
No.165795
Anonymous
>>165739
Thanks!

no pedo
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Replies:>>165837
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Update on this piece, Still need to do the shading. Anyone got any tips?
Replies:>>165844
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>>165831
I have this gunsmoke shading guide you could take a look at, it's basically the usual, use lighter colors first that shade details but the results look nice if you ask me.
No.165844
Anonymous
Replies:>>165880
>>165837
You also have to have the eye and the talent to know what shading goes where to get SunsetRiders/Gunsmoke quality results, too.
Replies:>>165934
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He seems to like this new girl a lot.
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No.165880
Anonymous
Replies:>>165978
>>165844
>You also have to have the eye and the talent to know what shading goes where
No that thing can be learned from books and "only" takes practice. That kind of fundamental stuff should really always be learned properly because it's univeral to every style you want to draw in. One of the best books to learn from is "Color and Light" from James Gurney
No.165934
Anonymous
>>165870
I'm alright with that. She is rather cute and I love that outfit.
No.165978
Anonymous
>>165880
>No that thing can be learned from books and "only" takes practice.
bwahaha are you for real? This reeks of the little kiddies whining "go read loomis an be good in 3 days" you see all over 4chan's drawthread. Chance you'll ever draw a stick figures : 0%
No.165989
Anonymous
>>165978

This. The science behind light and color theory is simple and can be learned in a single sitting from a book, online lecture or tutorial. The practice it takes in order to paint it correctly takes years.
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>>165978
I don't even know what your reply is supposed to be. Are you angry or plain confused? Practice, even if it's years of practice, is a lot less intimidating than "the eye and talent". And proper study material is the best help you can get because you can always look up stuff again as soon as you become uncertain about something. I really don't understand where your attitude comes from.

And here's a stick figure for you.
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The page was autosaging so I didn't know if you were going to catch this one or not.
Replies:>>166254
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>>166232
Not only that, there are two versions of the same picture. He first posted this one, then deleted it and replaced it with the other about five minutes later.
They look the same, until you directly flick between both...
No.166254
Anonymous
>>166232
>>166253

Thanks, nice catch.
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Hope he gets inspired by the new episode. Megan's cute, but she's a one-shot character.
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No.166773
Anonymous
Replies:>>166835
Kind of wish this guy would do some hardcore stuff instead of softcore all the time.
No.166835
Anonymous
>>166773
he did some in the past, but he's rather into grotesque and pain infliction, so people who mostly like him for the cute factor usually react pretty strongly. But he's rather irregular with that stuff.
No.166843
Anonymous
Replies:>>166938
>>166835
I sometimes get the impression simon's into pretty much everything, or is at least totally willing to cater to the fetishes of others.
No.166928
Anonymous
>>166835
Those Grojband pictures still make me hurt. I mean hurt as in OW because they were - OW.
No.166938
Sadarax
>>166843
He won't draw monster girls mostly. I once tried to ask him to draw Oblina from Aahh!! Real Monsters, either as her original self or as a humanized version. Said he didn't do that sort of thing. I think that's the first things I've ever seen him state he doesn't do.
No.166948
Anonymous
>>166938

That doesn't mean he doesn't draw monster girls at all, just Oblina. Most artists probably won't. Few people give a shit about that ugly ass show.
No.166987
Anonymous
Replies:>>166993
>>166938
how long ago did you ask? He seems to have phases of comfort zone drawing, and phase of experimental drawing. So it's not impossible that he might draw more freaky stuff one day, because he clearly likes to distort the human body at time, and monsters are a good way to play with anatomy.
No.166993
Anonymous
>>166987
Oblina is a cane though. She does not have much of an anatomy. And the thing he does not draw was probably her as a human. That is something he is a lot less likely to draw than Oblina in general.
No.167379
Anonymous
Replies:>>167426
Simon's stuff hasn't been very interesting for awhile. I keep checking in out of habit, but alas...

I'd still like to see that Astro Boy pic he did.
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>>167426
Nah, I was referring to the full version of this.
No.167479
Anonymous
Replies:>>167544
>>167426
this is Simon? reminds me of Nemurism.
>>167478
this looks so weird, the face doesn't match the more simple look of the head, it's really "uncanny valley" in a way
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>>167478
Oh that one, I think it's this one tilted a little.
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>>167478
As a bonus I have one more
No.167543
Anonymous
Replies:>>167601
>>167540

Maybe...I'm not sure. Check out the nose. Maybe it's just the shadows?
No.167544
Anonymous
Replies:>>167551
>>167479
>Uncanny Valley
wat

How?
No.167551
Anonymous
>>167544
because the face looks flat from the outline and robot nature, but the eyes, nose and mouth are drawn like they are on a "normal" skull. Also using a mostly brown pencil color for the whole thing raelly makes it like Astro's face is actually blank and flat and someone just drew over it. Robots are tricky to draw like that. With Simon's style is just doesn't work.
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>>167543
After further investigation I can confidently say that it is the drawing he used for the painted icon.

They fit almost perfectly onto each other, "almost" because ofcourse there are some changes that come from whatever adjustments were made during the painting process.

Something else to notice is that the grey bag can still be seen in the icon.

Whether or not he ever finished or posted the painted version is a mystery to me.
No.167682
Anonymous
i like a bikinis and swimsuit girls
No.167687
Anonymous
Replies:>>167695
Still frustrated that I´ll never see that Vanellope comic.
No.167691
Anonymous
Simon is so obscenely talented at drawing, he must work professionally for somebody.
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No.167695
Anonymous
>>167687
Oh, bloody hell, thanks for reminding me. I was really interested in the shota part that another guy mentioned.

And people say that Simon is a bro. Haaaa.
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No.167789
Anonymous
Replies:>>167791
>>167779
Where'd you get this from
Does Simon post somewhere other than /co/ since his tumblr shut down?
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>>167789

He posted a few drawings in GFG. Judging by the file names he just made them.
No.167798
Anonymous
>>164663
Simon kinda saddens me.

He seems like the type of person that would be a wonderfully successful and recognized artist if he applied himself.
I've seen people in his position before.

In the end they're brought down by their own insecurities.
No.167800
Anonymous
Replies:>>167974
>>167798
I´m more annoyed by professional concept art level furry artists who rather draw fetish garbage instead of doing something great with their skill and way of coloring.
No.167801
Anonymous
>>167798

But that's not it at all. Various people have said he's actually an editor/publisher. He already has a career, so he's only drawing for the love of drawing, or porn, or lolis. I t would also explains why he's so secretive.
No.167802
Anonymous
>>167801
It's probably the fact that many people would go pro with the skill Simon has and see it as a wasted opportunity but he simply has no necessity to do anything with it. For him it's pretty much optimal since he can enjoy what he does without pressure.
No.167803
Anonymous
>>167801
I like the way Zone rolls as another example, marketing projects he/she´s working on with porn. Thats a genius concept.
No.167816
Parasite !0IWTTbo3jA
Replies:>>167817
>>167801
>Various people have said he's actually an editor/publisher.
Various people also say Zone is a girl, or Moot is mexican.
No.167817
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM
Replies:>>167824
>>167816

All we know is, he's called The Stig.
No.167824
F-ing
>>167817
Brought it home nicely, Sage.
No.167841
Anonymous
A Mootxican?
No.167922
Anonymous
more more more art cartoon swimsuits now
No.167923
Anonymous
yes is my internet sexy swimsuit girls cartoon
No.167974
Anonymous
>>167800
>who rather draw fetish garbage instead of doing something great with their skill and way of coloring.

yeah, how dare people do things you dislike instead of things you like, what a waste.
No.168141
Anonymous
Does anyone have a full set of Simon's webcomic about Timmy and Trixie from Fairly Oddparents? Been looking for it forever on his deviantart account but couldn't find it. If it's not uploaded yet, I'll post some gifs on his work on Gravity Falls.
No.168142
Anonymous
Replies:>>168146
I´d like his Vanellope comic... did he even continue? Sigh... he shouldn't let us work so hard on finding his great stuff.
No.168146
Anonymous
Replies:>>168156
>>168142

That comic is 5 times longer than what he has made public. What we have is only half of the first chapter.
No.168156
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
Replies:>>168157
>>168146
He's doing a rather Silent Hill Gravity Falls one right now.
No.168157
Anonymous
>>168156
Yep. saw that on the panda. Not gonna ask why he goes into the dramatics or anything, everyone has their thing and it worked well, but... it as a bit dark. Good, though, just don't go in expecting daisies and shipping.

Here there be clubs...
No.168160
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
>>168157
Yea he gets into that place sometimes. Latter chapters of the aforementioned comic went that direction. Though more sex than..yea.
No.168161
Anonymous
>>168157
>Not gonna ask why he goes into the dramatics

It went that direction because GFG asked for a Silent Hill crossover, so dark+perverted subtext is the whole point.

He drew and wrote that on the fly in a day. It might have been more messed up if he was doing it seriously and not just screwing around on /co/, but I like that he kept it minimal. Most Gravity Falls grimdark shit is just gore. This is creepy and disturbing, and it grows on you the more you think about it.
No.168247
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM
Replies:>>168248
>>168241

Well that was all kinds of fucked up.
No.168248
Anonymous
>>168247

It was fucked up mostly without showing anything that's fucked up. In a few gifs, he made something that was true to Silent Hill without copying it. Out of the hundreds of "so and so in Silent Hill" threads, I don't remember anyone being able to pull that off.
No.168256
Anonymous
>>168241
Awesome.
No.168322
Anonymous
>>168241
Got a Paranoia Agent vibe from that and I loved it.
No.168323
Anonymous
Replies:>>168324
Anyone have that pic of Shanila from Dude Where's My Ghost with the nipple piercings?
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>>168323
As far as I know, here's every simon Shanila drawing:
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>>168324
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image:140905406700.png(171kB , 800x1000 , 75881_6_97608_20140309011020.png)
>>168325
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image:140905409000.png(249kB , 1000x800 , 75881_7_97608_20140309011021.png)
>>168326
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>>168327
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>>168328
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image:140905414600.png(179kB , 800x1000 , 76209_4_97608_20140311230613.png)
>>168329
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image:140905415700.png(179kB , 1000x800 , 76209_5_97608_20140311230614.png)
>>168330
Replies:>>168368
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>>168331
The end.
No.168364
Anonymous
Was wondering when Simon would make new lewd stuff, again.

Makes me wonder if anyone would have the cojones to upload the remained of the ever-elusive (and mortifying) remainder of the Vanellope comic (it'll be wonderfully-mortifying, I know it, :D )
No.168366
Anonymous
Replies:>>168392
I've seen it. I'm the one who posted about it in older threads. It's not at all what you imagine. It goes from very horrifying, to very sweet, and the last chapter isn't porn. It's a really long comic, too.

I'm sorry every day for not capping it when I had the chance.
Replies:>>168395
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Replies:>>168395
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Replies:>>168395
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image:140908457100.png(248kB , 900x600 , 1409023595437.png)
No.168383
Anonymous
Replies:>>168384
On one hand I love it, on the other hand I mostly don´t have a clue what Simon's drawing.
No.168384
Anonymous
>>168383
Well... I said that before I clicked the last 3 pics and I know her. I prefer his human crush though.
No.168392
Anonymous
Replies:>>168402
>>168366

Oh, I've heard the stories about it... being horrifying in some parts (and that's an understatement), to sweet in others... over 60-something pages, if I recall being told?

I guess I'm a glutton for punishment (and I always like pushing the envelope for myself, to see how strong [or weak] my threshold is).
No.168395
Parasite !0IWTTbo3jA
Replies:>>168402
>>168373
>>168372
>>168371
well at least we know Simon still browse /co/.
No.168402
Anonymous
>>168395

He's never been gone. That Gravity Falls comic was also drawn in a single thread, in a day. I was all ready for some nice Mabel + Pacifica hate sex, but someone suggested a Silent Hill crossover and he just went with that instead.

>>168392

I'll spoil it since Simon's never going to upload it again, I think.

It's over 200 pages. The first chapter is 40 or 60, maybe.

The worst thing that happens in the comic was King Candy caning Taffyta's ass for an entire chapter. All the evil shit she did was to protect Vanellope from suffering the same. Taffyta was never supposed to be a stand-alone racer, but a helper racer in co-op mode. She's basically nothing without Vanellope. You go from hating her guts to completely sympathizing with her. The feels are worse than the humiliation and violence.

Chapter 3 is Vanellope and Ralph fucking in his new pad. Chapter 4 is Vanellope giving that Reeses Cup kid a blowjob. Chapter 5 is King Candy's story that somehow ends with Ralph getting philosophical about how video games and kill screens. This chapter was still rough with incomplete art and writing, so I couldn't make out everything. I may be getting the order of 3 and 4 mixed up, but the entire comic is not in chronological order.
No.168409
Anonymous
Replies:>>168411
>>168402
Sounds amazing. I bet its impossible to find. This will be my holy grail to find for the rest of the year.
No.168411
Anonymous
Replies:>>168419
>>168409
Yeah neither google nor a 4chan archieve helped me a bit, and exhentai gives me the sad panda. This will be a hard one.
No.168419
Anonymous
Replies:>>168420
>>168411

I didn't save it because the pages were small and I couldn't right-click, and I assumed he was going to release the larger completed pages. Maybe a few people have seen it. I can't be the only one.
No.168420
Anonymous
>>168419
One one hand I understand how secret Simon is about it (I was drawing porn in a very unfitting job situation myself so I had to be careful), but on the other hand its too bad how he refuses praise by making his art a random encounter. He´s like a porn Banksy.
No.168421
Anonymous
Replies:>>168457
>>168402
I still hope that the reason he hasn't released it is he's secretly planning to sell it as a physical book at Comiket or something... curse my undying optimism.
No.168422
Anonymous
If you're reading this simon, we want to read the rest pretty desparately. I'd even be willing to pay for it.
No.168457
Parasite !0IWTTbo3jA
>>168421
I doubt he'd try to monetize using lolicon from a copyrighted material. Too much risk as a westerner. He could probably try selling adult OC's to begin with.
No.168459
Anonymous
>>168457
Monetizing that sort of thing at Comiket is probably pretty safe actually. As long as he doesn't try to sell it online.
No.168461
Anonymous
>>168457
>>168459

He doesn't do any of this for money. He refuses commissions. I've tried.
No.168463
Anonymous
>>168461

Well, I'd do something in exchange for it. Surely he must want something! Maybe I could dress up as Helga Pataki and berate him? Do... do you think he'd like that?
No.168465
Parasite !0IWTTbo3jA
>>168459
With comiket he'd have to go public, and he clearly doesn't want it.
No.168466
Anonymous
>>168461
I salute him. I hate people who draw as a hobby but then expect money for it. That has nothing to do with art anymore, its greedy. And in case its their only source of finances, its also lazy.
No.168478
Anonymous
>>168466

How is making money off a hobby greedy or lazy?
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No.168484
Parasite !0IWTTbo3jA
>>168478
not sure about lazy, but greedy is understandable when you spent so much time doing something for free, if you decide to make people pay all of a sudden it feels like a betrayal. That said most artist I have in mind still continue to make free stuff when opening commissions.
No.168500
Ghost
>>168478
From my view a lazy and greedy artist doesn't expand his own style, generic art, lacking new ideas, take the next money earn hype like drawing auctions, kickstarter or right now with patreon and maybe tries to gather Fame!

These types of artists are mostly in the furry community.
No.168505
Anonymous
>>168478
It's greedy in the minds of people who don't value art or artists, mostly.
No.168506
Anonymous
Replies:>>168545
>>168466
>I hate people who draw as a hobby but then expect money for it.
If people get paid for drawing in one way or another they're not doing it as a hobby anymore.
>That has nothing to do with art anymore, its greedy.
An artist is still human. Rent, food and other bills need to be paid. Trying to pay your bills with something people might give you money for is not greedy. It's common sense.
>And in case its their only source of finances, its also lazy.
This is simply bullshit.
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No.168533
Anonymous
>>168466

Artists should get paid as much as the market can bear. There are artists who are awful but still get plenty of commissions, and then there are artists like Simon who won't do commissions even if we throw money at him. But you know what, that's completely up to them.
No.168545
Anonymous
>>168506
>If people get paid for drawing in one way or another they're not doing it as a hobby anymore.

Depends how much they get paid for each pic and if the pics are worth the amount. I´ve seen terrible, TERRIBLE stuff sold for 50 bucks while I´ve seen great stuff for 25 bucks... for example.
Terrible stuff included a Kirby speed drawing with colored markers which looked like a kid making it being sold for 50 bucks. Great stuff included sketches for 12 up to 25 bucks by very awesome but rather unknown artists, even pixel artists.
No.168559
Anonymous
>>168545
>Great stuff included sketches for 12 up to 25 bucks by very awesome but rather unknown artists, even pixel artists.
And those people are a blight on the industry because they devalue art in the mind of the consumer. They undervalue their own work and therefore convince consumers that it is acceptable to pay a skilled artist $2-$3 an hour for their work.
No.168580
Anonymous
>>168559

They don't devalue the industry. They force everyone else to become better. If someone who wants to make money by doing art full time cannot become more skilled than someone who does it for fun, they need to change their line of work. Art isn't fair. It's like sports, it's part knowledge and hard work, part talent and intangibles. If you don't have it, too bad.
No.168582
Anonymous
Replies:>>168589
>>168580
>They don't devalue the industry.

No matter how good you are if someone mediocre is 10 time less expensive than you then you are fucked. It's folly to consider 3$ an hour acceptable in any sort of way.
No.168584
Anonymous
Replies:>>168823
>No matter how good you are if someone mediocre is 10 time less expensive than you

Then be 10 times better than him if you want to justify your price.

Look, I support good artists being paid their worth. But to be honest with you, most artists who whine about this aren't all that great themselves. The whole reason professionals are paid is because they have some skill that is in need, and is rare. The computers and the internet which made it easier for you to enter the industry made it easy for everyone else too. Being an average artist is not good enough.

You're complaining about something that you have no control over. You can't control what other people charge. You can't control what other people are willing to pay. Pricing is never going to be a logical thing.
No.168585
Anonymous
>>168580
No, they offer their great work to the others instead of being greedy pricks!
Though there are idiots like a certain Bayleaf "artist" who decide to abuse those artists by creating huge galleries of commissioned garbage and not doing anything themselves. Overall I hate to see great artists drawing garbage for underage requesters with terrible tastes, ideas, stories and fetishes.
No.168589
Anonymous
Replies:>>168604
>>168585
>>168582
>>168559
>>168545


Fucking Christ you'll still going on with this bullshit! You sound like those "elistist" assholes who go out of their way to stop other people from making income in any industry; whether it be hairdressing, interior decorating, fashion, etc.

Despite your perceived intentions you're insulting both professional and amatuer artists alike. You deem artists with less skills (according to your opininon) unworthy to make money from their work even though customers are willing to pay for them. You insult professional artists by claiming that others with less skill and a lower price will threaten them. NEWSFLASH! Artists who are really good and popular will have more customers than popular artists with mediocre skills.

Check the livestreams and compare the amount of viewers between artists like Atryl and Karavan and tell me that amatuer artists are threatening the industry.
No.168590
Anonymous
>>168585

Translation; BAWWW!!! STOP DRAWING WHAT I DON'T LIKE!!
No.168604
Anonymous
Replies:>>168605
>>168589
>You insult professional artists by claiming that others with less skill and a lower price will threaten them

Too bad it's true. you can cherry pick streamers as you want, glorifying people who make art for cheap just lead most professional artist doing less than wellfare because any professional contract will go to retards that actually accept a 2$ per hour deal. streamers are a negligible minority of the industry.
No.168605
Anonymous
Replies:>>168606
>>168604

Evidence! Provide fucking evidence like I did. Otherwise you're talking out of your ass. Simply stating some doesn't make it true. I still see artists of exceptional skills making plenty of money despite the amount of lesser skill ones. That's true of any industry and if you can't realize that than you'll in denial. And fuck you by saying streamer are a negligible minority. Streaming is a effective tool for attracting customers and is gaining popularity with artists of many mediums.
No.168606
Anonymous
>>168605

*something. I am spelling error.
No.168823
Anonymous
>>168584
>Then be 10 times better than him if you want to justify your price.

People like you are why I don't post porn when I draw it anymore.
No.168824
Anonymous
Replies:>>168835
Relax, kids. It's only cartoon porn ^_~
No.168825
Anonymous
>>168823
He kinda lost credibility when he said "ten time better" when talking about art anyway.
No.168827
Anonymous
Replies:>>168899
>>168823

How else are you going to justify your price to a customer like that? Either you are worth ten times more than the other guy, or you can admit that kind of customer was never going to buy from you, and he's not the kind of customer you want, so it doesn't affect your bottom line anyway.
No.168835
Anonymous
>>168824
Seriously. I don't see the point of fighting over what people want to charge for their art. It's not your art so shut up. Why are you arguing about it? Then I remember where I am.
No.168842
Anonymous
What's the deal with commissions anyway, is there an ombudsman you go to if you're not satisfied with the art? Or are you just screwed out of a coupla hundred because it's embarrassing to report being robbed in that manner (ie: Report: I said foot sex in Gwen Tennyson's ass, but he drew vaginal sex)
No.168854
Anonymous
Replies:>>168857
>>168842
What's the deal with ovaltine anyway?
No.168857
Anonymous
>>168854
HAHAHA!!!! no idea. never tried it myself.
No.168864
Anonymous
Replies:>>168869
>>168241

wow that was pretty cool, where did he do this?
No.168868
Anonymous
>>168842
In commissions in general, it should be work for hire with a contract signed by both parties establishing what is expected of the artist and what the commissioner is entitled to. And yes, you can take someone to small claims court for breach of contract.

But in practice with pornographic commissions, it's true that most people would be too embarrassed to bring it up. So most likely you just start giving them bad publicity on the web, through social media like Tumblr or by commenting in their threads with warnings to other potential commissioners.
No.168869
Anonymous
>>168864
In Gravity Falls General on /co/
No.168883
Anonymous
>>168842
>ombudsman

Hah.

There is no guarantee that the artist is going to draw exactly what you have in mind, and you shouldn't have that expectation anyway. You're hiring someone who presumably knows better than you in art, and it's often better to go with the artist's instinct than yours. That said, most artists will do a quick sketch and let you make suggestions before doing the final.

You need to do your own research before commissioning. Look at the work they've done for others, ask other buyers about their experiences. Non-delivery is a legitimate gripe, but you are never guaranteed 100% satisfaction. That's just not how it works.
No.168899
Anonymous
Replies:>>168903
>>168827
how would you even quantify what's ten times better? That's also assuming all commissioner tastes are equal. Some would pay top dollar just to see their fav character's feet. Quality doesn't even factor.
No.168903
Anonymous
Replies:>>168904
>>168899
>how would you even quantify what's ten times better?

You can't! Not in some absolute way. That's why it's stupid to complain about other artists under-charging. If you can't quantify quality, you can't set minimum pricing for the industry. Customers don't give a shit how many hours it takes for you to finish drawing. That's not their concern.

Value is a fluid thing and dictated by the market, and no amount of complaining is going to change that. Welcome to self-employment where some people are going to beat you on price. If you're a decent artist, then the kind of commissioners those bottom of the barrel artists get are not the kind of business you want anyway.
Replies:>>168917
>>168903
>That's why it's stupid to complain about other artists under-charging

I disagree with that simply because it makes competition fatal. If you keep cutting prices to "keep up" at some point your not getting your return on investment, you're at a net loss of either time or money and most likely both. That's why undercutting is harmful, eventually it makes it impossible to do business.

>If you can't quantify quality, you can't set minimum pricing for the industry
But you can quantify time spent on the individual piece and time spent gaining the skills to execute. Not even counting living expenses/internet connection etc.

>Value is a fluid thing and dictated by the market, and no amount of complaining is going to change that.
"The Market" is not some perfect force separate from humanity, always watching. The market is made up of people, if undercutters set the precedent that art is cheap then that affects prices. For example, outsourcing. In fact, I'd say it was anti-competion/free market to under cut price for the fact that actual quality no longer matters, it's useless to compete when actual value (in this case draftsmanship) is depreciated.

>If you're a decent artist, then the kind of commissioners those bottom of the barrel artists get are not the kind of business you want anyway.

on this though I wholly agree.
No.168917
Anonymous
Replies:>>168922
>>168904
>I disagree with that simply because it makes competition fatal.

No it doesn't. If you really believe that people are charging so little that they are harming themselves, they will eventually cut themselves out of the business won't they? If those people are somehow able to make a living from it and you can't, then the problem is you, even if it is not of your doing.

>But you can quantify time

You can quantify time, but you cannot attach a base value to time. What of those artists who live in a country where the cost of living is 5 times less than the US? You think they ought to charge at your level, just to make everything fair?

Besides, time is irrelevant to the customer. A 20 second sketch by a master artist is going to be worth more than what you or I can whip up in 1 week.

>if undercutters set the precedent that art is cheap then that affects prices.

Welcome to reality. All profession is based on availability of skill, and a lot of people online draw at middling quality. Either you separate yourself from the pack by becoming better, or you are affected by market forces. Get real for a moment here. Only a very small percentage of artists make it, this has always been true. This porn commission "market" practically didn't even exist a few years ago. Be honest, how many porn artists are skilled enough to be making money from art before the internet? Most of them shouldn't even be making any money now unless tracing porn pics and hentai is fucking art.

There's nothing different now except you are competing globally. If you want things to be fair, then everyone's standard of living has to be the same. Get ready to pay three times as much for that computer and tablet.

>I'd say it was anti-competion/free market to under cut price for the fact that actual quality no longer matters

Go to Pixar or Lucasfilm and tell them you can draw for 2/3rd the price of their lead artists and see how far that gets you. Quality still matters. There are just tiers, and that low to middle tier where pricing forces are stronger has become really large.
No.168922
Anonymous
Replies:>>168928
>>168917
>No it doesn't. If you really believe that people are charging so little that they are harming themselves, they will eventually cut themselves out of the business won't they?
they won't because idiots that do this are usually on welfare already, or have rich daddies and shit like that
No.168928
Anonymous
Replies:>>168935
>>168922

Someone who can't draw or market well enough to differentiate himself from idiots, welfare recipients, and trust fund amateurs should re-examine his career choice. This might be a little hard to swallow, but if you have to complain about what other people charge for their services, then maybe you just aren't that much better than them, and the amount of skill you have isn't all that special.
No.168932
Anonymous
Replies:>>168938
Simon threads are a lot like the WHOMP threads on /co/. Whereas Ronnie threads spiral into an oddly amusing discussion about food and the different foods across the world in nations, Simon threads always become a discussion about... well, I never bother to read what you guys ae saying. I'm here for the pretty pictures, mostly.

Still, it is a nice consistency.
No.168935
Anonymous
Replies:>>168938
>>168928
>Someone who can't draw or market well enough to differentiate himself from idiots, welfare recipients, and trust fund amateurs should re-examine his career choice.
Sorry, but this is a completely void statement. I'm not sure of what job you do for a living but people working for less than the very value of work will hurt no matter what.
Replies:>>168939
save file
image:140969596300.png(345kB , 700x900 , simon_oscar_school for vampires.png)
>>168932

We have to do something to pass the time between Simon posts. It's getting harder to come by his pics, especially porn. Let's pretend this is a loli.

>>168935
>people working for less than the very value of work will hurt no matter what.

You're still assuming there's some kind of minimum wage for artists when you are you own business, and there are too many factors that go into pricing which you chose to ignore. Should foreign artists raise their prices just to meet your standard of living? Should shit artists get $100 a pic just because it took them 8 hours to draw it? What about an artist who can draw the same picture as you, but he can do it in 1 hour when it takes you 5? Hell, I watched Simon animate during one of his picarto chats. Maybe the reason he does all of these drawings for free but refuses commissions is because sketching is a trivial thing to him.

Bottom line, there is no minimum wage when you're self-employed, and you have no control over anyone else's pricing. Either elevate your skill to a level where it is actually rare and you can charge a good price, or get a side job like the rest of the average people do. Cheapskates and cheap artists aren't forcing prices down, they're forcing you to become better to get a decent rate.
Replies:>>168940
>>168938
>I hope there is no animus, I just disagree with your outlook.

>If you really believe that people are charging so little that they are harming themselves, they will eventually cut themselves out of the business won't they?

Not necessarily, and it's not just themselves that they would affect. For better or for worse, those that undervalue will set precedent for rates for commissioners.

>You can quantify time, but you cannot attach a base value to time. What of those artists who live in a country where the cost of living is 5 times less than the US? You think they ought to charge at your level, just to make everything fair?

Yes, you can. Businesses set hourly rates all the time, why shouldn't a freelancer?

>Besides, time is irrelevant to the customer.

And that is also irrelevant, they're paying for the artists' skill set. It's up to the artists to decide whether the project is worth their time and how much they're time is worth.

>Either you separate yourself from the pack by becoming better, or you are affected by market forces

You are convinced that "market forces" are this perfect equalizer. Their are people making a living simply because they draw fan art, regardless of quality. There are artist that are way above them in skill level that also struggle. There's more to freelancing art than being a good artist, although that's a part of the equation. Some just lack business acumen, and I think a part of being a good businessman is knowing what your worth.

>Go to Pixar or Lucasfilm and tell them you can draw for 2/3rd the price of their lead artists and see how far that gets you. Quality still matters.

No offense to them, they've certainly earned the right to dictate their wage, but lead artist at AAA studio does not represent the market. Quality matters, but there are more forces at work.

As an aside, I think simon is in the industry, but wants to keep his personal work separate, for obvious reasons.
Not that I object to his underage stuff, I actually look up to his drawing ability, but loli isn't for everyone, and could probably get you blackballed at the least.
No.168940
Anonymous
Replies:>>168942
>>168939

No animus at all. I curse casually and I use "you" rhetorically.

>those that undervalue will set precedent for rates for commissioners.

How would you know they are undervaluing? Some foreign artists enjoy a pricing advantage, and some artists work a lot faster or can draw without breaking a sweat. There is no way for you to account for those, and no way you can change other people's pricing just because their rates wouldn't work for you. It may work just fine for them. If not, they'll go away eventually.

>Businesses set hourly rates all the time, why shouldn't a freelancer?

You can do that if you want, what I'm saying is that you are not guaranteed a minimum wage, which is kind of what you're arguing for for an entire industry. It's impossible, it's not workable, and if businesses did that with each other, it'd be illegal collusion. It's cartel behavior.

>It's up to the artists to decide whether the project is worth their time and how much they're time is worth.

No disagreement there. So why are you complaining about artists setting prices too low?

>You are convinced that "market forces" are this perfect equalizer.

Never said so. My point is that those market forces are outside of your control, just like other artists' pricing. You should only worry about your own ability as an artist, and what makes business sense for you. If you actually have your own unique style and can provide something that few others could, then you get to set the price you want. Most artists who complain about low commissions simply don't provide anything that is drastically different from the other guy.

>I think a part of being a good businessman is knowing what your worth.

That worth has to be in context with what the market and your competitors are willing to bear. I;; say it again, this is a profession, and professions depend on the rarity of the skill/talent. What the internet has shown us is that there is a huge pool of low to middle tier artists who wouldn't be making one penny from their art before the internet age. They could only cause problems with people who are at their level. Get better.

>I think simon is in the industry

Simon has said he works in publishing. Maybe it's comics, maybe it's children's books. That would be a fucking riot.
No.168942
Anonymous
Replies:>>168943
>>168940

>How would you know they are undervaluing?

Like you said it's an internet age, the information is available.

>Some foreign artists enjoy a pricing advantage, and some artists work a lot faster or can draw without breaking a sweat.

And that's good for them, that has nothing to do with what rates are sustainable. It's literally a race to the bottom if the only way to compete is to lower prices, all the while devaluing your "product" and the market.

>I'm saying is that you are not guaranteed a minimum wage, which is kind of what you're arguing for for an entire industry.

Ah, no. You are misrepresenting my argument. I'm not asking for a law or regulation, I'm advocate for artist not to be so disparate, letting consumers dictate what they are worth. "But consumers DO dictate what they are worth". And if you think that way, you'll never make the kind of wealth you might otherwise deserve. AAA lead artist may be great at what he does, but that's not the end of it. they're smart enough to run there own careers, and stand firm on their rates and the jobs they choose. If AAA lead artist cut their rates, AAA studio will pay the lower rate, regardless of how valuable they are. THEY have to establish their price, and they have to seek out the clients who see their worth.

>It's impossible, it's not workable, and if businesses did that with each other, it'd be illegal collusion. It's cartel behavior.

What I'm advocate for would be closer to a union in this theoretical situation, which already exists i.e. graphic arts guild.

>No disagreement there. So why are you complaining about artists setting prices too low?

I'm not I just wish more artist were business savvy.

>They could only cause problems with people who are at their level. Get better.

Competition doesn't evaporate at an arbitrary tier of work. And there's other factors to getting a job. Getting better is expected, it's not a quality that gets you hired necessarily, unless you're "discovered".

Imagine going to teacher's night at your kid's school and finding out simon's got homeroom.
No.168943
Anonymous
Replies:>>168946
>>168942
>It's literally a race to the bottom if the only way to compete is to lower prices

What do you think I've been saying all along? Get better. If you're worried about other people driving your prices down, then guess what, you are also playing a race to the bottom, except you want to dictate where the bottom should be.

>I'm advocate for artist not to be so disparate, letting consumers dictate what they are worth.

Whether you like it or not, consumers will let you know whether you've priced your art well by giving you commissions, or passing you over for someone else. If you're getting more work than you can handle, congratulations, move your prices up. This isn't desperation, this is being savvy.

But this is getting away from the original discussion of whether artists are hurting the market by pricing low. They're not. They're only forcing you to become better.

>If AAA lead artist cut their rates, AAA studio will pay the lower rate

No, you're wrong. Once again, profession is based on rarity/scarcity of skill. The higher tier skill you're looking at, the fewer available talent there are. Studios compete against each other to get the best talent they can get. (This is why the whole non-poaching thing between Pixar and Dreamworks is such a big deal. They're supposed to compete for talent at that level.)

Obviously, I'm not saying there's a single inversion point between where you're scraping by on shitty commissions, and having top employers competing against each other for your services. There's a range, and you want to keep moving up so you aren't surrounded by a bunch of artists with a similar skill set as you.

>graphic arts guild

Guilds don't set minimum wages. They can't. They issue recommendations based on average market data. Unions represent salaried employees against employers. You, as a freelance artist, are your own boss. It is collusion if you band together and set a minimum wage. You're supposed to be competing against each other, on quality *and* price. Not to mention this is completely unworkable anyway, because artists can choose not to be a part of your cartel. They're competing with you, and they'll want every advantage at their disposal. Price is one of those things.
No.168946
Anonymous
Replies:>>168948
>>168943

>Get better.

You keep saying this and it's still not the only factor. The U.S. is the epicenter of entertainment art, we probably have more talent per capita simply because this is where all the jobs are, and jobs are still outsourced.

I think this is the crux of our disagreement, there are a lot of artist that are good, not all of them are making money, why is that? I think your position is that the markets are rational and the best talent get the best jobs always, am I close?

> profession is based on rarity/scarcity of skill

In a perfect world, maybe. If you want an extreme example, nepotism.

>The higher tier skill you're looking at, the fewer available talent there are. Studios compete against each other to get the best talent they can get.

That doesn't have anything to do with what the artist charges. If they undercut themselves, the studios aren't going to upsell them out of the goodness of their heart. You have to be even more firm as the stakes grow, or you'll be railroaded.

For example: There's a practice where studios will ask for holds on an artist, meaning that they'll reserve a period of time in the future where they may or may not ask for work. The artist, if they accept are contractually required to pass up work during this period where the MAY be hired. This contract comes with no payment. So in essence you are giving up time and money for the CHANCE of possible work.

Working by your logic, artists should jump at this chance because it would give them a supposed edge in the market by reserving work for themselves. In actuality the more artist that agree to this, gives the studio the impetus to simply tie up as many artists as possible, giving them the greatest variety of product, and possible leverage to force rates DOWN. It's good for studios, and bad for artists. There's no competition, it's anti-free market

>minimum wages

Again, not what I'm saying. The guild exists to organize artists who would otherwise be individuals "against" the hiring firms. Setting rates isn't asking for a minimum wage, it's to a tool to keep the client from underbidding. The more people who cooperate, the greater leverage the rates hold. It's like calling a picket line a cartel, and the scabs competition.

Though we might have to agree to disagree, were getting into coded language.
No.168948
Anonymous
>>168946
>You keep saying this and it's still not the only factor.

It's not the only factor, but it is the factor you are in control of. Other people's pricing is not. So why get stuck on that? It's a waste of your time.

>we probably have more talent per capita simply because this is where all the jobs are, and jobs are still outsourced.

They're outsourced because other people can do it cheaper, or faster, or both. You're not in control of it. I said this pretty early on. I don't know where the disagreement is. Thinking those other artists should stop undercutting you is utter foolishness.

>If they undercut themselves

They're not undercutting themselves, they're undercutting you.

>There's a practice where studios will ask for holds on an artist

Holds/first-right-of-refusal is a courtesy, not a matter of contract, and I don't know why you're bringing this up. It has nothing to do with pay rates or how artists who charge less affect you.

>Setting rates isn't asking for a minimum wage

If you want to apply those rates to everyone, then yes, you are setting a de facto minimum wage. It's illegal to do so.

>It's like calling a picket line a cartel, and the scabs competition.

When you are freelancing, you are your own boss. I cannot make this any clearer. When competing businesses conspire to set prices, you are acting as a cartel. This isn't opinion, there's no room for interpretation here. This is why guilds don't do that.
No.168951
Anonymous
Replies:>>168957
Well this thread sucks.
No.168952
Anonymous
>>168948
>It's illegal to do so.
It's actually illegal to ask someone to work for *less* than minimum wage, in civilized countries. When these artists ask for less than minimum wage for their art, it's the same issue that crops up when workers in other fields complain about outsourced labor to countries with looser minimum wage laws--people who may be more skilled but who can't afford to work for as little lose their jobs to people who are worse at their jobs but are either unprotected by, or too ignorant of them to ask for, the protection of labor laws.

Look, I get it: you benefit from taking advantage of these people, so you want to keep them ignorant of their rights and make sure they don't get it in their heads to ask what they deserve. But you show how little you value the work of artists when you do so. You see them as rubes to be taken advantage of, or as little better than slave labor, because you don't consider the work they do to be worth as much as someone who has trained as much as them in any other field, even though there are fewer people who HAVE those skills. That is exactly the problem here: the culture of valueless art that has been brought about by amateur artists on the internet giving people like you free shit so that you don't have any respect for the work it takes to make this stuff, or the value of these artist's time.
No.168957
Anonymous
Replies:>>168959
>>168948
>>168948

>Holds/first-right-of-refusal is a courtesy, not a matter of contract, and I don't know why you're bringing this up. It has nothing to do with pay rates or how artists who charge less affect you.

I assumed a written, or even verbal agreement was binding, even if itsn't, it's still not a good practice and it's a reflection of how LOWLY art is valued even when all IPs are defined by it. Which affect rates.

Which I have to agree with >>168952 , I don't think you value art that much.

>They're outsourced because other people can do it cheaper, or faster, or both.

I noticed that you specifically left out better. Again, competing on price devalues art, and frankly makes GOOD art less viable. I do love to draw, but it's not just a hobby.

>They're not undercutting themselves, they're undercutting you.

You seem to think this is for selfish reasons, artist outside the US are just as vulnerable. With most of the entertainment industry centralized, they can just as easily dictate lower wages for them as well, to the point where conversion rates no longer buffer them. "Don't like it, where else you gonna work?"

>If you want to apply those rates to everyone, then yes, you are setting a de facto minimum wage. It's illegal to do so.

Again, there isn't an application of anything. It's cooperation, it's education, it's knowing what you are worth. Even hobbyists are making something of value, that they don't know or convinced that it isn't is the problem. Unions aren't trusts, this isn't price fixing.

>When competing businesses conspire to set prices, you are acting as a cartel.

You trying to force a sinister perspective on this. Almost ALL service industries have going rates, and as individuals you have the right to negotiate up or down depending on the deal. That has nothing to do with with setting STANDARDS. You would never tell a electricians union they are being a cartel by negotiating a standard of pay, which they do, nor would any court tell them what they are doing is illegal. The guild exists to protect their industry, and that includes setting rate standards.

...but >>168951 is right we're shitting up the thread with OT. Consider this agreed to disagreed, I'm bowing out.
No.168959
Anonymous
Replies:>>168990
>>168952
>It's actually illegal to ask someone to work for *less* than minimum wage, in civilized countries

When you are working freelance, you are not an employee, and there is no minimum wage, because you aren't making a wage. You either take the job, or you don't, and I hope you don't when the price is undo-able for you. But don't be so willfully ignorant of law.

I'll give you an example. Let's say you value yourself at roughly $100 an hour, and you take a freelance commission for $1000 and plan to spend 10 hours on it. It turns out to take you 20 hours to do. Do you think you can now ask for $2000? At best, that client will never work with you again. At worst, they're going to sue you for breaking contract for non-delivery.

>When these artists ask for less than minimum wage for their art, it's the same issue that crops up when workers in other fields complain about outsourced labor to countries with looser minimum wage laws

And you can't stop it. There's nothing you can do about that. They charge less because their standards of living is lower, while they provide the same level of service, and there's a huge number of them going after the same jobs. This is only a problem because the skill and service they provide is no longer rare. There is a surplus of that skill level, that's what's pushing prices down. It is your own responsibility as a professional to offer a rare skill.

I pointed this out before. If you want everyone to be competing on equal footing, be prepared to pay many times more for your computers and equipment. Be prepared to lower your standard of living.

>That is exactly the problem here: the culture of valueless art that has been brought about by amateur artists

This is not about me hating artists or keeping people ignorant, but about people like you being entitled and unrealistic. I would pay an arm and a leg if the artist is someone I like, because he can provide something others cannot. All of these amateurs doing middling work means you can't expect a professional commission if you also do middling work.

>>168957
>it's still not a good practice

It's a practice in many fields of contract work, whether you find it fair or not. But it's part of professionalism. If you're not available to them in a flexible way, that's just another one of those non-skill-related things that makes you less valuable to that employer. If you're talking about video games, then their schedules are very tight. They can't be held up by one artist. Make yourself available, or they'll find an artist who is more so.

>I noticed that you specifically left out better.

Sometimes they are, but for the purpose of discussion, I left it out to highlight that when skill is equal, then pricing matters. That's the problem I pointed out from the start. If you skill level is equal to that of a large swath of artists, amateur or not, then your skill isn't as valuable and you are susceptible to being undercut.

>It's cooperation, it's education, it's knowing what you are worth.

Then accept that, from the consumer/employer's perspective, some people will beat you on worth.

>You trying to force a sinister perspective on this.

No, I am explaining to you why guilds don't set minimum wages. It's cut and dry.

>You would never tell a electricians union they are being a cartel by negotiating a standard of pay

They negotiate as a group with an employer. They don't negotiate rates for others. When you are a freelance artist, you're competing with other artists. That's what makes any suggestion of a standard problematic, the fact you conspire with your competitors. This is a false equivalence.

I'm not shitting on artists. I'm pointing out how unrealistic, protectionist, entitled, uncompetitive, and possibly incompetent it is to blame low tier artists for lowering pay when the real problem is scarcity of skill, or lack thereof. If you're going to hang onto this, fine. Waste your time on something you cannot possibly change instead of competing on quality of service. I'll bow out too until there's a new Simon drawing to post.
No.168990
Anonymous
Replies:>>168991
>>168959
Going freelance doesn't make you immune to unfair competition laws.
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>>168990

Show me one law that prevents other artists from underbidding you, or sets a minimum wage for freelance artists.
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Replies:>>169051
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A deviation from the norm: Little Audrey, Little Dot and Little Lotta (if I'm recognising everyone correctly).
No.169035
Anonymous
Replies:>>170197
I´ll never see that Vanellope comic because the way to get around the sad panda has more flaws and issues than getting to the ending of P.T.
No.169051
Anonymous
>>168994
Well, Simon managed to make a non-lewd eyeball lolipop licking picture sexy.
Simon: 1
Me: Fuck all
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No.169089
Anonymous
>lewd lewd lewd lewd lewd lewd

Its either always the same person or American internet users lack of words.
No.169090
Anonymous
>>169089
It's a 4chan buzzword.
No.169093
Anonymous
Replies:>>169096
>>169089

The trolling mostly comes from one Russian or Polish pedo named Cyrus who's so very jealous and pissed that Simon doesn't pay attention to him. Everyone saw this first hand on picarto. I asked Simon why he puts up with him, and he said he doesn't mind it because Cyrus uploads good shit or something, so I guess he knows him from somewhere else.
No.169096
Anonymous
Replies:>>169097
>>169093
I witnessed his behaviour on Picarto, but as I said when you mentioned this on /co/, I feel you're attributing way too much to him. It borders on misinformation.
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Don't know if this is new or just a pic I missed or forgot.

>>169096
I didn't post about this on /co/, but I think I saw it. There was a lot of people in that room so I'm sure I wasn't the only one who noticed. If it isn't the same guy, then he sure says a lot of the same shit. He was showing off his own awful drawings at the same time. The guy was totally desperate.
No.169098
Parasite !0IWTTbo3jA
Replies:>>169112
Simon hasn't drawn nudity in ages, this thread feels kinda out of place on that board at the moment.
No.169112
Anonymous
>>169098

Simon straddles a really thin line. Many of these might not technically be porn, but they're also not things I would post anywhere else. I'd rather see them collected here than be lost with the threads.
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No.170164
Anonymous
Replies:>>170165
>>168402
I went through the trouble to enter ExH and you fucking lied. Hell, go and lie to the other 4th-graders in your class to pose off as important, but don´t fuck with people like me.

Asshole.
No.170165
Anonymous
>>170164

Nobody fucking told you it was on ExH.
No.170197
Anonymous
Replies:>>170199
>>169035
It's on sadpanda? The whole thing? Or just the pages that we saw previously?
No.170199
Anonymous
Replies:>>170257
>>170197
Just the previous pages. I misunderstood one of the previous posts, hoping that the chance is high to find it there. But no.

Overall, wasn´t worth it to get access.
No.170257
Anonymous
>>170199
ExH is great you fool, explore further before deeming it a waste of time.
No.170277
Anonymous
I´m furtherly exploring and its okay so far. But I didn't really think about what to look for before I got the account.
No.170288
Anonymous
What's ExH? Tried googling it but just got stock market sfuff
No.170291
Anonymous
exhentai
Replies:>>170610
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Thank god for archive.moe.
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No.170606
Anonymous
Replies:>>170610
It got deleted but there was an Angelica in the Angelica thread.
No.170610
Anonymous
Replies:>>170613
>>170606

So you mean this one? >>170601

That's the only one I see on archive.moe.
No.170613
Anonymous
>>170610
Whoops didn't see it. Yeah that's what I'm talking about.
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Hmmmm...interesting.
Simon just posted a few new Sofia the first sketches on his old tumblr:
http://simontblr.tumblr.com/post/99543730471

Hopefully this means he'll go back to posting stuff there regularly...until he decides to delete it all again.
No.170749
Anonymous
That is interesting. One of two things will happen now, either he'll once again take all his work down after about six months, or sensitives will push authoritah on him even though his posts are cartoons.
No.170778
Anonymous
Replies:>>170809
>>170749
Why does Simon do that, anyway? It's kinda tiring to see this happen all the time.
If he has problems, it's not his fans' fault, his gallery doesn't need to suffer the consequences.
He deletes his pictures on a whim, when you least expect it, but he never deletes his account, then why deleting your pics? People are going to re-post them anyway so it's not like you really hid your artwork, they're gonna find it sooner or later.

I love the guy's artwork but I feel he doesn't value his own art, basically.
No.170809
Anonymous
>>170778
>>170749

I don't think it's either of those things. He's not intentionally pissing people off, and he obviously wasn't going to get shut down on Pixiv because of loli. His HF disappeared way before the loli crackdown.

Artists aren't attached to their work the way fans are, and they shouldn't be. We collect drawings because they are valuable to us, and average r34 artists are only in it to get themselves off, or to make money. But serious artists learn a skill for its own sake. Simon can delete all the drawings he wants, because it won't take that skill away from him. He values the activity of drawing, but not the product or even the fans I guess. He talks to other artists on /ic/ all the time, but never on /co/ as far as I can tell.
No.170843
Anonymous
>>170809
>But serious artists learn a skill for its own sake.
That seemed to be his reasoning when asked during his streams.
No.170861
Anonymous
He does come off as if there's a personal reason behind removing the art from time to time though. Something having to do with finding himself or "thanks for the memories" type of thing. But he posts around here so it's kinda confusing.

Fanartbox was an interesting time though. Simon posted to there like it was a haven during his "account dry spell". Then Tumblr closed the account and he wasn't necessarily posting anywhere after that.
No.170903
Anonymous
Replies:>>170930
>>170809
>He talks to other artists on /ic/ all the time
Wait, still? I thought he'd up and left completely after all the derails, or is he just posting without redlining now?
No.170930
Anonymous
>>170903

I just meant he'd talk with the artists on /ic/ about drawing, but he doesn't respond to people on /co/. At most he'd sometimes do a request, but it seems like those requests coincide with his interest at the time.

He's never posted with a trip or name, so he probably does chat on /co/ and /ic/ all the time, but we wouldn't know it.
No.170968
Anonymous
more more more now!
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Dear diary, today Simon did some pudge. Today is a good day.

Because I like irls with some meat on them. Unf. Also the skinny is just uncomfortable, ya dig, diary?

Your friend, anon.
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No.171091
Anonymous
anne-marie, are you drunk?
No.171095
Anonymous
>>171091
She's just showing that she still takes care of her underwear.
No.171101
Anonymous
>>171091
If she were drunk she'd wear 'em like a lampshade.
No.171220
Anonymous
more more more now!
Replies:>>171257
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This image disappeared from his tumblr again. Dunno why.
>>171237
Because it's Simon, and the crusaders always preform a witch hunt for his art and are still trying to ban him from Dumbler as we type right now...
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Simon's doin stuff for Conoghi's patreon.

http://www.patreon.com/user?u=163765
No.171300
Anonymous
Replies:>>171303
I recall seeing a few drawings on fanartbox before it was nuked of younger Kim Possible in a training/sports bra, but I can't seem to find them. Anyone happen to have them?
No.171447
Anonymous
http://www.patreon.com/user?u=163765

if someone could get the patreon pics and upload them hear would be much appearated
No.171460
Anonymous
You can try paying for it.
No.171462
Anonymous
You guys need a new thread.
No.171463
Anonymous
Why must Conoghi and Simon's friendship make me so curious?
No.172261
Anonymous
more more more more more now please come on please
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Sample for patreon
No.172297
Anonymous
Replies:>>172633
more more more more more more more now please
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Sample for Patreon
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Sample for Patreon
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Sample for Patreon
No.172330
Anonymous
Replies:>>172529
just pay on the patreon. its just $4 dollars every two weeks.
No.172484
Anonymous
Replies:>>172633
more more more more more more more more more more please now
No.172529
Anonymous
>>172330

Here's a BETTER idea: Someone ELSE do it, so we can all mooch. He has some good Patreon-based crap up now, and I ain't payin' for it, me being jobless... somebody will... someone will.
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>>172529

Case in point... a preview Karen from Frosty the Snowman.
No.172539
Anonymous
my biggest fear is simon finding out about the leak than quitting... again
No.172549
Anonymous
Replies:>>172570
>>172529

Wait til you get a job then become a patron. The pics will still be there. Maybe. Okay, that's a big maybe.
No.172570
Anonymous
Replies:>>172571
>>172549

I've never payed for ero-pics, and I never will. Hence my facetious, snarky proposal of "Let someone else do it".
No.172571
Anonymous
Replies:>>172582
>>172570

Cont'd

And NOW that I've blurted my plan out... now nobody will do it.
No.172582
Anonymous
>>172571

thisiswhywecan'thavenicethings.jpg.bmp.png
No.172633
Anonymous
>>172595
>>172596
>>172484
>>172297
chill
No.172647
Anonymous
Replies:>>172760
Not much, but I have this old pixiv video of his coloring GF's Wendy. I had a lot more of these pixiv links, but for some reason they're all broken- not sure why this one survived :/

http://chat.pixiv.net/roomtop.php?id=365692
No.172652
Anonymous
If I had the viable scratch I'd so donate to the patron to get access
No.172740
Anonymous
What's the newest Simon archive, had to redo my folders and lost the old one.
No.172760
Anonymous
>>172647

Hmmm.... so does anyone here HAVE Mypixiv access to Simon's Pixiv page... or does he not post up anything anymore, and I'm wasting my time sending him a MyPixiv invite?
No.172820
Anonymous
Replies:>>172829
more more more more more more more more more more more now please
USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST
No.172829
Anonymous
>>172820

Hey, ASSHOLE! Stop spamming the same fucking thing, over and over!
No.173008
Anonymous
Replies:>>173019
Ugh, that show's so terrible even Simon's skill ain't doin' it right
No.173019
Anonymous
>>173008

Then a get a Patreon and get his GOOD shit!

p.s. I honestly didn't mind the Rainbow Brite Reboot. I just had to remind myself it wasn't the original, treated it objectively, and it was honestly entertaining (but not "perfect").
No.173469
Anonymous
more more more more more more more more more more more more now please come on!
USER WAS PERMABANNED FOR BEING AN OBNOXIOUS FUCK
No.173474
Anonymous
>>173469
>>173470
No, fuck you.
No.173501
Anonymous
>>173469
>>173470

OMFG, THIS ASSHOLE, AGAIN?!???!
No.173511
Anonymous
Replies:>>173518
Status of thread: abandoned on account of Simon updating again or otherwise not posting anywhere else.

May there be a new thread that pops up somewhere that THAT ONE GUY doesn't know about >:T
No.173518
Anonymous
>>173511

More likely the latter, since Simon ONLY posts his not-so-clean stuff on Conoghi's Patreon, and nowhere else (to my knowledge).
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.....(sigh) Bump?
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I'd wish he did more Stacy...
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Come on gents, I can't be the only one here now...
Replies:>>173656
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....Bump again?
No.173656
Anonymous
Replies:>>173670
>>173633

You're NOT the only one here. You ARE, however, the one with anything from him since he only posts his new shit on Conoghi's Patreon.

I can't find ANYTHING of his that's Rule34 that CAN be accessed.
No.173657
Anonymous
>>173634

Also, I suggest you make a new thread, as this one can't be bumped up, anymore.
Replies:>>173709
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>>173656
Nope, it's all from that E-Hentai site...You just have to look REALLY hard for his stuff. Darq is the only one I know who has access to that patron thing...soo your going to have to ask that bloody nit to share...
No.173709
Anonymous
Replies:>>173939
>>173670

>ask him to share Patreon, blah blah blah

Yeah... no. Also, why don't YOU ask him, since you KNOW him?
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>>173709
>why don't YOU ask him, since you KNOW him?

Umm, I don't know..MAYBE because we don't talk anymore since I had an opinion on why Simon stopped doing free porn...I wasn't even trying to troll...ever.
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....Oooh yeah...Bump.
No.174093
Anonymous
Replies:>>174131
it can't bump anymore
No.174131
Anonymous
>>174093

MAKE A NEW THREAD!

Why does nobody get that?!
No.201173
Anonymous
Bump
No.201174
Anonymous
Bump