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radio
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Space battles: The Revenge
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Happy May 4th, everyone!

Have 2 completely different in tone videos:
//youtube.com/watch?v=wxWz0EnbLjkyoutube thumb

//youtube.com/watch?v=p5LS4gOc4_Ayoutube thumb
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46305
Anonymous
http://spinoff.comicbookresources.com/2016/06/01/rogue-one-a-star-wars-story-reshoots-will-add-levity-fun/
Oh come ON.
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46309
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>46305
People are freaking the hell out about these reshoots.

Why are people freaking the hell out about these reshoots?

This pervasive internet myth that a standard Hollywood practice heralds UNTOLD CATASTROPHE is getting really tiring.
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46310
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>46309

I think it’s less about the fact they’re happening and more about why they’re (supposedly) happening.
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46311
Anonymous
I've read other reports that its not Reshoots perse but just additional shooting days that were scheduled including a placeholder for Young Han when he was eventually cast.
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46313
Anonymous
>46310
The claim that they're being done to make the movie more "fun" sounds like the Suicide Squad ones all over again.
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46315
Anonymous
>46313
And those turned out to be fake, so...
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46321
Anonymous
>46315
>Fake
Reported "inaccurate" by the already in-shambles PR department in WB.
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46335
Anonymous
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/star-wars-rogue-one-enlists-899530

Making it less like a war movie.

Its a funny note because watching Half in the Bag stuff on Star Wars and hearing their critique during streams. Making it more like a war movie would be a better tone giving the sides and the conflicts involved.
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46486
Anonymous
Word now is the shoots were in planning from the start of production.
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46487
Anonymous
>46486
Don't most movies made by Disney do? I remember the Marvel movies having a similar "controversy" during the Feige-Perlmutter split fiasco. Bleeding Cool tried to claim the MCU movies were so horrifically financially mismanaged and misdirected that they needed last-minute reshoots but a bunch of other articles pointed out it's been known for years most of these movies have planned reshoots along with a section of the budget for them. Same with Suicide Squad most likely.
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46490
Anonymous
>46487
Yea I think sometimes it's filming placeholder scenes and then the full ones later.
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46508
Anonymous
Finally saw Force Awakens. Pretty solid felt like a good continuation like the next set of a trilogy of books. New Characters carrying on from the old with some reference to them and a little of their inclusion.
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46541
Mister Twister
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46564
T4 was here
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spoiler
And this is why I was not worried about the loss of the SW:EU.
OFCOURE THEY GOING TO CHERRY PICK THE GOOD SHIT.
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46566
Anonymous
>46564
Yea I think that was one thing stated long ago that the story group would just look through and get the good ideas out.

Hope we get the Maw Instillation back and the Corporate Sector Authority.
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46567
Anonymous
I hope we get Revan back too.
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46568
Anonymous
>46567


Way too much Sith lore was put into Old Republic to think they'd abandon all that with that becoming more a focus.
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46569
Anonymous
I think I saw Dark Troopers. Maybe they can bring back Kyle Katarn after all.
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46570
Anonymous
>46569
Someone also noted what looked like a YT-2400 Freighter. So maybe even some Dash in the future.

Clone Wars still cannon so Black Sun is already in.
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46571
Mister Twister
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>fucking Jedi Bendu
>Admiral Thrawn
Dave is the hero we need, he is saving EU one brilliant move at a time.
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Anonymous
>46571
All it took was cutting out the bad parts. So the Vong get banished to the trash pile.
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Mister Twister
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Anonymous
>46597
ooof, a really "what might have been" Situation. You know if Palpy hadn't earmarked Anakin and just ignored his masters machinations about a "chosen one". Later Clone Wars Season Obi-wan would have been prime turning material.

Lost the love of his life, Jedi Council consistently getting into more shadowy control things. I think Palpy could have appealed to him that the system is broken (rotting and decaying) And that there needs to be something new to stabilize things.
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46600
Mister Twister
>46598
I don't know... the way I always saw it, Anakin was created in the first place to be the most powerful apprentice for the Sith.
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Mister Twister
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So, Dave really likes wolves, named a SW character Okami, and wanted to have pic related in the show (she morphed into the alien woman in Slaves of the Republic).
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Anonymous
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http://screenrant.com/star-wars-rogue-one-u-wing/

Neat.

//youtube.com/watch?v=p8ExkYS_Uogyoutube thumb


X-wing gets a new sibling

U-Wing Transport/Gunship
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46794
Anonymous
After the nightmare the reshoots caused Suicide Squad I'm scared for Rogue One again.
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46795
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>46794

Suicide Squad's reshoots were the result of WB's "oh fuck" reaction to BvS’s assfucking from critics. I doubt Disney has the same "we need to save the franchise" fears about Rogue One.
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46796
Anonymous
>46794

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/06/23/star-wars-rogue-one-reshoot-concerns

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/rogue-one-drama-writer-tony-916695

I think it'll be fine. Disney won't panic and throw something out that is a shit edit that is connected to their tentpoles.

And this doesn't have Squads problem with about half the cast being obsessed trying to do method acting.
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46799
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>46796

Or the director enabling it.
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46884
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
The full trailer for Rogue One has arrived:

//youtube.com/watch?v=frdj1zb9sMYyoutube thumb
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46885
Anonymous
>46884
I like the Droid maybe a model of the IG line.
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46890
Anonymous
>46884
Man Whitaker is just not doing it for me. I hope he's not like that all the time.
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46892
Anonymous
Kenny Baker (you know him as the guy inside R2D2) just passed away. RIP.
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46897
Anonymous
>46892
Damn that's a shame. Read he consulted on Episode VIII as they've gone with using a dude in the suit again for some scenes with Artoo.
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Mister Twister
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Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47068

How many “lightsaber battle” fan films need to exist before everyone realizes how shallow they are? A fight in and of itself isn't a conflict, but a mechanism for solving a conflict—and there's no conflict here beyond the surface level "Jedi vs. Sith" conflict. I was given no reason to care about the Jedi (or Kylo Ren, for that matter); as a result, the Jedi's death didn’t come off as meaningful or sad or whatever effect the filmmakers were going for. If anything, the length of the fight and the lack of anything meaningful in the film gave me more of a feeling of “finally!” once the Jedi was killed.

I’d love to see one of these fan films put a Sith against a Jedi in what you might call a philosophy debate—having them each talk about why they use the Force they way they do—before they go at it in a lightsaber battle. Give me opposing perspectives, justifications for their actions, an actual conflict deeper than the kind of “good vs. evil” conflict that a six-year-old could write. If a fan film can give me a reason to give a shit about its characters beyond “they can swing a sword in a neat way”, I’ll care more about that fan film.
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Mister Twister
>47069
People do them for fun.
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Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47070

I’m well aware of that. More power to ’em. Doesn’t mean I can’t criticize the lack of depth in such fan films.

(And the ridiculousness of the lightsaber battles themselves, for that matter. I’m surprised someone hasn’t gone full wuxia with the concept, which might be the only way of really making these kinds of films worth watching. I mean, if you’re gonna do all this over-the-top swordfighting, go fully nuts or go home, yo.)
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Anonymous
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>47070
Doing things for fun is alright, but Mr Stone is right in that fan films like these are al flashy glitter with no substance, nothing to set them apart beyond the basic "lol lightsabers so cool". I mean, this one is titled Kylo Ren - The Awakening, which made me think the makers of the film would try to say *something* about the character, but in the end it was just a well done lightsaber fight against a random Jedi that appears with no explanation.


OTOH, It's been almost 20 years since Troops was released, and people still fondly remember that fanfilm because it did something different. I can't remember the name of any "lol lightsabers so cool" SW fan-made shorts released last year, much less twenty.
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47073
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47072

>a well done lightsaber fight

I'd argue that it wasn't even well done—it was just a hollow action scene that was more about putting on the affectation of “cool” than trying to use the action as a vehicle for characterization. Anyone can choreograph a lightsaber battle like the one in that fan film, but it takes talent far beyond that to make that battle tell a story about which people can give a shit. Like I said, a fight isn’t a conflict, but a means to solve a conflict; why should I give a shit about a fight if I don’t give a shit about the underlying conflict (if there even is one)?
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47074
Anonymous
>47073
Well, at least there was SOME moves that were neat, gotta give credit to the makers of that short, they used the concept of a light-crossguard in a more interesting way than the actual movie.

And yeah, no conflict. Who is that Jedi? Why should we care? If I had to guess and do the writer's work (one thing is to fill the blanks, but here there isn't even any blanks), the Jedi perhaps was one of Luke's apprentices and Kylo's buddy and he is there to regrettably put a stop to his fall to the dark side, but it could also be easily constructed that he was just some guy Luke left to live with the Ewoks, to watch over his dad's charred remains. Now THAT'S a shitty assignment if there ever was one.
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47075
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47073
An excellent point and a good reason why I could never get into that Darth Maul fan film everyone was lapping up last year. It's a little mystifying why Star Wars fan films concentrate almost exclusively on fully-fledged Jedi and kewl lightsaber fights when a: the mainline films already have those covered, and b: they're amongst the least interesting aspect of Star Wars.

>47072
Troops was a damn fine exception to the fan film norm. A more recent one that broke the mould (I feel) was "Kara," by Whitelist. It has emotion, heart, character, a proper arc, and while it does feature a force-sensitive, it actually uses force-sensitivity to tell a metaphorical story about adolescence and loss (there's shades of Carrie to how Kara's powers manifest) rather than treating it as an excuse to do 'bzew bzew' mouth noises:
//youtube.com/watch?v=013r_PNIcxsyoutube thumb
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47076
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47075

>It's a little mystifying why Star Wars fan films concentrate almost exclusively on fully-fledged Jedi and kewl lightsaber fights when a: the mainline films already have those covered, and b: they're amongst the least interesting aspect of Star Wars.

I’d argue something along the lines of Film Crit HULK’s “tangible details” theory, in that those kinds of things are the most visible and thus easiest-to-replicate aspects of the Star Wars franchise. It’s relatively easy to put together a choreographed swordfight, toss in a few lightsaber sounds and effects during editing, and call it a day. But breathing life into the swordfight beyond its surface is a far harder task. It requires knowing character motivations and perspectives, figuring out what kind of conflict would require this fight to resolve, and a sense of dramatic structure—in other words, it requires knowing how to tell a story.

I mentioned wuxia a few posts back, and CinemaFix loves to bring this scene up (see //youtube.com/watch?v=t3_d5Y0Gr3cyoutube thumb for their best take on it), so I’ll point to this specific fight scene from Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon as an example of what I mean: //youtube.com/watch?v=DFH6lXJ6c4kyoutube thumb
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Anonymous
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People concentrate on Jedi and lightsabers because it's easier, the cruise control for cool. It's a guaranteed crowd pleaser, plus most of the creative work is already done, like Stone mentioned you don't need to know how to tell a story for that.

Guess nobody remembers what certain greenskinned midget said about taking the easy path.
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47079
Anonymous
>47076
Thing is, you don't even have to look outside Star Wars. Both times Luke and Vader tussle in the OT are wonderful examples of a fight being there to help tell the story, and not just to be cool. The choreography itself tells you about the characters (love when Vader just starts pummeling Luke by flinging random debris at him) and what they are feeling.
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47081
Anonymous
>47078
You meant the little green pseudo-wise man?
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47089
Anonymous
If Rey is a Skywalker:

//youtube.com/watch?v=mjHEHuNyvMEyoutube thumb
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47159
Alpharius
Mr. Plinkett's The Star Wars Awakens Review
//youtube.com/watch?v=miVRaoR_8xQyoutube thumb
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47160
Anonymous
>47159
Lol, didn't click!
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Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47159

Dis gon’ be gud. [gets the popcorn]
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47162
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
So! Having watched the new Plinkett review, I can tell you this: He had more criticism for the state of the Star Wars franchise and Hollywood’s risk aversion by way of “soft reboots” and storytelling clichés than he did for The Force Awakens. But what criticism he had for TFA seemed pretty on the rolling robot ball—especially the bits about an over-reliance on comedy and the film’s lack of any kind of sex/“heart”.
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Anonymous
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>47159
>"Then there's the issue of the forced diversi--"
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47164
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47163

Yeah, that whole bit about diversity was just…ugh. This review was easily one of their most underwhelming, especially when taking the Prequel Trilogy reviews into account. And I get it—TFA wasn’t an outright horrible film like the Prequel films were, so there wasn’t much they could rag on here. But of all the hills to die on, the diversity issue was one they actually chose?
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47165
Anonymous
He actually very specifically says that the diversity bit was a good thing.

I mean RLM are a bunch of fucking weirdos that hang out with Landis and say dumb shit sometimes, but in this case he's absolutely on point: It's good that they did it, and they did it well, but kids wouldn't have given a shit either way, only us adults.
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47166
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47165

>kids wouldn't have given a shit either way

And how does he know that? How can he know that?
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47167
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
Also, >47165:

>He actually very specifically says that the diversity bit was a good thing.

Considering how he talked about the cast’s diverse makeup all but being a corporate mandate from Disney—who he railed against earlier in the video as a bland, soulless, risk-averse corporate machine that sucks the life out of anything it touches (Star Wars included)—I don’t get the impression that he believes it was a good idea.
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47169
Anonymous
>47167
>Considering how he talked about the cast’s diverse makeup all but being a corporate mandate
Which it probably was. That doesn't make it a bad thing. His comments on Disney-As-Machine are accurate, they totally are risk averse and they've got Star Wars on an assembly line (hopefully a more solid one than the Marvel line).
>47166
>And how does he know that? How can he know that?
He doesn't and neither do you. It's a guess. A guess I agree with. Kids will like Star Wars because it's Star Wars. That's not an insane statement.

He says he thinks it's a good thing that it's there. It is. He also says it's a product of Disney that Lucas would have never done. It's also that. Kids probably wouldn't have cared if it wasn't there (though they'll subconsciously process it probably, normalization and all that), but WE would have so it's there for us.

You can get after them for busting out a hot "SJW" awhile back about something or other because that's pandering to fuckers but on this they're more or less on point and also make a point to single out and shit on said fuckers.
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47170
Anonymous
>47165
>but kids wouldn't have given a shit
Kids don't give a shit about diversity in the sense that they don't care for adults' preconcieved notions on it.
ie they didn't dislike Korra because it didn't feature a man - they were ambivalent on the protagonist.

That doesn't mean it doesn't have an effect or that kids don't see gender or race.

To say Star Wars didn't have any identity politics just because it was white is a pretty ignorant assumption for good ol Mike to make. But that speaks more on him than it does the Star Wars franchise.
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47171
Anonymous
>47170
>they were ambivalent on the protagonist
And that's what I'm saying and I think what he was trying to say, albeit in the most roundabout way possible. Kids don't like or dislike things based on that. It affects them in a different way. That doesn't mean (speaking for myself since he didn't get into this) that it's not important to have it in stuff for kids since it normalizes it for them (media being a form of socialization like anything else is), but it's not something that they are cognizant of in the same sense.

As for saying that star wars didn't have any identity politics, he addresses that it did by talking about Lucas' white Californian world I feel.
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47172
Anonymous
>47163
>47164

I'm so glad the alt-right has taken up to championing the criticisms of TFA in the comments section so that my dislike and criticisms of the movie's themes and story, which I think is actually weaker than any of the Prequels, can now be completely written off as "lol mysogonistic basement-dwelling nerds lol XD."

TFA has better acting and special effects than the Prequels. And those are the easiest things for laymen to grasp. But it is far, /far/ weaker in story structure, internal logic, pacing, characterizations, and world building than any other Star Wars film, and these are things that they failed to really touch upon. I think this video underscores the weakness of Red Letter Media as film reviewers and their ability to only grasp the very obvious. Also, by including "lol political correctness cast" as one of their key arguments in their critique, they damage the critique as a whole. There's a saying for debates: you're only as good as your weakest argument. And while they may be right with their speculations about the motives of the politically-correct casting, this does nothing to actually critique how the film functions as a movie, and only adds fuel to an already inane internet flame-war.
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47173
Anonymous
>47165
>47169
>47171 here
I should stress that I think that the reason why I think this is a relevant point for him to bring up is that the review is less a review of the film and more a review of Star Wars as a Thing. It's a complete cutting of ties with any notion of SW as being Lucas' thing or anyone else's and a transition to it being the output of well oiled machine. As to using it as a criticism of the film itself, it's a useless point.
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47174
Anonymous
>47170
>47171
>they were ambivalent on the protagonist.

The people polled were small boys. The ones who would've "gotten the short end of the stick" so to speak. It wasn't a case of "they dont give a shit" it was them not feeling slighted against for having a GUUUURL PLAY WITH BOYS.
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47175
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47172

>it is far, /far/ weaker in story structure, internal logic, pacing, characterizations, and world building than any other Star Wars film, and these are things that they failed to really touch upon

As I mentioned to Film Crit HULK via Twitter: Captain Phasma’s near-worthless role in the movie, despite all the hype surrounding the character and the casting of Gwendolyn Christie in the role, could’ve been a whole segment of the review on its own. Not just to discuss how the film could’ve made the character better (which the review sorta touched on), but how she was a transparent attempt to recapture “the magic” behind Boba Fett, and how the character wasn’t given anything of importance to do in the film (other than “look badass” and “get caught by the rebels”). The whole review came off as RLM not really wanting to rip into TFA because they thought it was at least “good”, so they went after Prequel apologists, the Ring Theory guy, Lucas, and Disney instead—and it’s not that those entities don’t deserve to have their cages rattled, so to speak, but it’s just not the same thing as the Prequel deconstructions, and it shows.
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47176
Anonymous
>47175

Abrams is always a good subject to go after. Star Trek '09 was his resume for the Star Wars gig showing he could handle space epics.

Thing is a lot of the script for The Force Awakens feels a lot closer to some kinda fan fiction he wrote and didn't really want to part with. Almost as bad as Solo Lucas type writing cept at least Lucas did a bit more to establish things and not just recycle a whole movie pretty much beat for beat.

Sure we've got setups on how things will deviate going forward but the movie itself...eh. Its good but its not something I'm going to buy the Blu-Ray at t full price for.
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47177
Anonymous
So how pissed will be people at next film and Rey having a heel turn. Snoke dropping Benny like a hot potato because Rey has a much deeper anger and hate to exploit.
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47178
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47177

I’d be all for that, personally. The New Trilogy shouldn’t just be a repeat of the Original Trilogy. A double turn with Kylo and Rey—provided it’s done well—would be the kind of risk that could give the New Trilogy its own identity and a solid direction to go in for Episode 9.
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47179
Anonymous
There's literally nothing less interesting than the notion of Kylo switching place with Rey short of just having Christensen back again.
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47180
Anonymous
If Rey goes Dark Side, holy shit, that would mean Luke really sucks at being a Jedi master.
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47181
Anonymous
>47180
Remember that you can always blame the writers.
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47182
Anonymous
>47181
Nah, it actually makes sense for Luke not being *that* good at the job. I mean, at best he got a few months of training under Obi-Wan and Yoda (and that's being generous with the timeline). As great as Yoda's intensive course may have been, and as gifted as Luke was, that's not enough to learn all the ins and outs of being a Jedi and how to resist the Dark Side.
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47183
Anonymous
>47180
I still think Adam Driver is gonna Zuko it.
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47184
Anonymous
>47183
Kylo isn't Zuko so much as he's like if Lin murdered Toph and drove Aang into hiding for 20 years.
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47185
Anonymous
>47184
If Toph's contract negotiated her to get killed off in the first movie, that is.
But I see your point.

I'd like to see him try and be good, though. He's got an interesting character design, but I do imagine it would be hard to redeem him after laser-shanking pops.
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47187
Anonymous
>47185
Well if he comes back from the Dark Side and Luke accepts that then I could see frayed relations between Jedi and the Republic.

Which I kinda like that idea. Republic knows they are needed as mediators and protectors. But that one event keeps them from ever being trusted.
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47188
Anonymous
The entire interesting thing about Kylo is that he rejected redemption where Vader accepted it, I don't want him, I like Rey as the hero.

Audiences in general are also not liable to embrace the kid that patricided fucking Han Solo either.
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47189
Anonymous
>47188
For the time being. I got the feeling he still felt regretful after he did it, and the novelization (which reflects an earlier version of the movie so it might not be entirely canon at this point) is very explicit about it. He's still capable of going face later on or at least not fully embracing the whole Sith thing, even if I doubt he'll ever be a full hero.
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47190
Anonymous
You know, I'd like to see how they would convince Chewie to forget what happened and not break Kylo in half upon seeing him.
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47193
Anonymous
Snoke keeps trying to catalyst Ben into a true sith but he just doesn't have that deep well of hate to draw on.

Now Rey. I bet he can make her go full sith with just a bit of isolation and digging into her abandonment issues.
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47194
Anonymous
>47190
I want Chewie to throw Ben into a volcano like it's fucking Tekken.
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47195
Alpharius
>47194
It's like you want Kyo to crawl back out. You have to go Mortal Kombat on the bugger and have Chewie rip his spine out.
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47197
Anonymous
What if Snoke purposely trained Kylo wrong, as a joke?
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47198
Anonymous
>47195
But nah he's gotta throw him into the volcano. At which point he suffers almost no damage. Because he's still a loser compared to his grandpa.
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47199
Anonymous
>47197
I can see that. Boy so wanted to be like Grandpa, but couldn't ever get it right. So Snoke just Palpy'd him and just jerked him around for kicks until someone worthy came along.
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47206
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
“We have hope. Rebellions are built on hope!”

//youtube.com/watch?v=sC9abcLLQpIyoutube thumb
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Mister Twister
>47206
Darth Maul had hope once.

It wasn't fun.
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47208
Anonymous
>47207
Even Jar Jar had hope once.
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47213
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47207
>47208

Good thing they're both dead/not appearing in this film.
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47228
Anonymous
http://www.vulture.com/2016/10/donald-glover-lando-calrissian.html
So Donald Glover has been cast as Lando Calrissian in the Han Solo prequel film.
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47229
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47228

That deal just got better.
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47230
Anonymous
>47229
I pray it'll improve further, though.
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47231
Anonymous
Will he be able to pull off that silky smooth conman gambler persona?

Will we see him play a game of Sabbac
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47320
Mister Twister
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Seriously, Rebels is just the best.
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47346
Alpharius
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How did Dameron get off of Jakku and get back to the Resistance base?
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47351
thatother1dude/PKS88+dMMc
>47346
Probably "borrowed" a ship.
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Anonymous
>47346
Novelization says he got saved by a rando who sent him off in a ship before Finn came to.
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Mister Twister
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525365
Well, only 1 part left, before the epic saga is completed:
//youtube.com/watch?v=oOmyuweolqYyoutube thumb
replyreportdelete
47372
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47371

I thought that YouTube username looked familiar.

//youtube.com/watch?v=IkMPZ7WeDckyoutube thumb
replyreportdelete
47433
Anonymous
So much for Jyn being Rey's mother[ I'm glad it's quashed because it was a stupid theory anyway.
replyreportdelete
47434
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
Man, that was an emotional rollercoaster.

Also, Disney may have stumbled upon a way of avoiding giving away a movie's most impactful moments in the trailer. Just shoot another movie after the trailer comes out.

Anyone afraid that the reshoots were intended to lighten the movie's mood can rest easy. It was fucking brutal holy shit my heart.
replyreportdelete
47435
Anonymous
>47434

Maybe one of the movies can show us the Battle of Taanab as that was where Lando gets his bona-fides as a general. Also the Battle of Nar Shadda (where afterwards the Falcon changed hands from Lando to Han) would be a neat addition.
replyreportdelete
47437
Anonymous
>47434
IN a good or bad way?
replyreportdelete
47438
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47437
In an indescribably awesome way, IMHO, but I'm wary about colouring people's perceptions.
replyreportdelete
47453
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
http://birthmoviesdeath.com/2016/12/16/the-unsung-praises-of-the-phantom-menace

I can understand a defense of the Prequel Trilogy's few good points. I cannot, however, understand how someone who writes such a defense can also excuse the quality of those movies.
replyreportdelete
47454
Mister Twister
Rogue One is a real masterpiece. Masterfully written, masterfully acted, masterfully executed. It builds upon the original movies, while doing its own exciting, and often new things. Characters from previous movies come back (through CG magic or actual people) for all the right reasons, and are handled with utmost respect. Apparently the idea to make Rogue One came about before the Disney buyout, and the story was mostly a one man vision, so that probably helped with the quality. Will happily accept this movie as the grand finale for Rebels.

Don't care much for the new trilogy, but will always care for this one.
replyreportdelete
47455
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47454

>Characters from previous movies come back (through CG magic or actual people) for all the right reasons, and are handled with utmost respect.

I have heard more than a few objections to the CGI Tarkin because of how people believe it could result in future CGI “resurrections” of dead actors.
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47456
Anonymous
>47455
They believe it "could"? It's going to happen sooner or later, most likely much sooner than we think, now that the tech is kinda getting there. No way around it, hell it's probably become a great bussiness for the estates of dead actors, selling their likenesses.
replyreportdelete
47457
Anonymous
>47456
Hollywood has been gearing up for that for a long time. Being able to digitally recreate dead actors was always going to be a thing eventually.

Heck I was a bit weirded out seeing '90s edition RDJ in Civil War.
replyreportdelete
47458
Anonymous
>47457
Yeah, back when Final Fantasy was released (15 years ago, right?), there was plenty of buzz about digital replacements of actors.
replyreportdelete
47459
Anonymous
>47458

Yea, though when interlaced with real actors it seems to be less jarring than full CGI, though that may just be because the tech is better now.
replyreportdelete
47460
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47457

Thing is, something like RDJ’s de-aging, the unused footage of Marlon Brando used in Superman Returns, the farewell to Paul Walker that was Fast & Furious 7, or the CGI Tarkin worry me, but they do not make me fear for the replacement of live actors or the full-on resurrection of dead actors. All those things made sense in context. The possibility of another Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow situation is what scares me. That movie used archival video and audio of Sir Laurence Olivier to insert him into a movie that was filmed more than a decade after his death and had no connection to his body of work as a living actor. If Hollywood resurrects actors this way — to appear in movies that have no context to the actor’s body of work, just to answer a “wouldn’t it be cool if…” question — we will have on our hands an issue that only financial boycotts can resolve.
replyreportdelete
47462
Mister Twister
>47455
New technology can be used for great good, or..... for great eeeeeeeeeeevil.
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47463
Anonymous
You know, while the CGI Tarkin was fine, I did find the CGI Leia a bit distracting. I guess it is because Peter Cushing already had some uncanny facial features? Dunno.
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47464
Anonymous
>47460

Oh you are very much limiting yourself in how far they'll go. They won't just digitally insert or recreate. We will get Replicants since digital still has some limitations that cannot be met from a natural environment
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47465
Anonymous
>47463
Nah it's not just you, her face was oddly shiny and plastic looking compared to Tarkin even in still moments.
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47466
Anonymous
>47465

CGI still cannot do natual renders for all characteristics.
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47467
Anonymous
>47465
I think a big factor was that Tarkin's scenes were all in relative darkness, whereas Leia was shown in a brightly lit room.
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47470
Anonymous
I must say this: I liked Rogue One better than TFA, but I liked the leads in TFA *much* better. Especially Daisy Ridley, her Rey was all around much interesting and fun to watch than Felicity Jones' Jyn.
replyreportdelete
47471
Mister Twister
>47470
Story ≠ characters.
replyreportdelete
47472
Anonymous
>47453
>I cannot, however, understand how someone who writes such a defense can also excuse the quality of those movies.

It's funny, because I cannot understand how someone who can excuse the quality of TFA.

//youtube.com/watch?v=8g9cJ5WKZeUyoutube thumb
replyreportdelete
47473
Anonymous
>47472
Thats cus you're a contrarian.
replyreportdelete
47474
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47472
You can understand perfectly well how someone can "excuse" the quality of TFA. You're just pretending not to because your sense of self-worth is built around starting pointless arguments with complete strangers on the internet.
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47475
Anonymous
>47470
Very much this
Jyn felt very flat. She didn't really have anything going on while all the characters around her were much more interesting. By gods did Alan Tudyk kick ass.

Beyond that, the story WAS tons better than TFA.
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47476
Anonymous
>47475
I wouldn't say *tons* better. I mean, it takes ages for the actual plot in Rogue One to start rolling, which would have been fine if they had used that time for character development, but we didn't get much of that either.
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47477
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47476
TFA and Rogue One each did their own thing and both did them extremely well. It's not like it's a competition or anything, they both make Disney massive shedloads of dosh. It's good that the mainline Episodes like TFA stay fun and light-hearted and adventurous with recurring characters we fall in love with, but Rogue One is a triumphant validation of Disney's plan to explore other genres inside the enormous breadth of the Star Wars universe to tell good stories.
replyreportdelete
47478
Mister Twister
>47477
I'd say TFA fulfilled its role as ANH remake extremely mehwell.
replyreportdelete
47479
Anonymous
>47478
I agree MT, how COULD a woman ever learn to fight?
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47480
Anonymous
>47479

Yesss, not loving unconditionally TFA means you hate them women, imrite or imrite.
replyreportdelete
47482
Anonymous
>47479
Am I getting Poe's Law'd right now.
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47483
Anonymous
>47474
>You can understand perfectly well how someone can "excuse" the quality of TFA.

I actually cannot. The Prequels got raked over the coals, they were the punchlines for jokes, nearly everyone and their goddamn brother pointed me towards those Red Letter Media video editorials. TFA was worse than each of the Prequel movies (even the Phantom Menace) from a story standpoint, and to me story is king when it comes to movies. Characters need to progress in a logical sense, scenes should have a meaning behind them when they are included, and most of all there needs to be some level of a satisfactory resolution to events. Yet I see people claim TFA is better than Return of the Jedi despite failing at each and every one of those elements. So no, I don't actually understand how people enjoy The Force Awakens.
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47484
could be anyone, really
>47483
Older fans enjoy it because it is just like the very first Star Wars movie they seen, the one they fell in love with.

Younger fans enjoy it because it is an entertaining fast paced action movie with a female protagonist who actually looks believably strong, even if her writing is bullshit.

Also, do not forget that for a good half of the SW fanbase the movies are just escapism. They turn their brains off when watching them.

/opinion
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47485
Anonymous
Guys, bad news: Carrie Fisher had a heart attack while in flight to Los Angeles, and apparently her condition isn't good. Let's hope for the best.

Damn you 2016, you had to be an asshole to the very end.
replyreportdelete
47486
Anonymous
>47485
FUCK! DAMN YOU 2016!
replyreportdelete
47488
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
I was trying to have a nice Friday with a little bit of checking-in on my usual Internet haunts before I went fully offline to enjoy Christmas. But between >47483 and the news of Carrie Fisher having a heart attack, this is not a nice Friday. So now I have a few things to say.

>47483

The Prequel Trilogy received loads of negative criticism for reasons related to story and characterization. Look at the absolute mess that was “The Phantom Menace”. Take a moment to remember the awkward, wooden romance sub-plot of “Attack of the Clones”. Remind yourself of the “oh shit we have to do Vader in this movie” pacing of “Revenge of the Sith”. The entire Prequel Trilogy has structure, characterization, and (especially) dialogue problems that not even George Lucas’s ex-wife could edit away. If they were metaphorically shat upon by audiences and critics, the movies earned that treatment.

By comparison, “The Force Awakens” is, at worst, a mediocre re-tread of “A New Hope” with new characters replacing the older ones. The movie may have problems with characterization and structure — and with trying to be “a ‘Star Wars’ movie” a little too much — but those flaws do not rise to the levels of the Prequel Trilogy’s flaws. Those flaws do not make “The Force Awakens” unwatchable on its own.

And this is where I had planned to bow out and leave things at that and go enjoy the rest of my Christmas weekend…but then>47484 had to make a post, so now I have something else to say.

If you want to think of Rey’s writing as “bullshit”, you are free to do so. But before you turn that opinion into personal dogma, remember this: In the span of a day (at best), Luke Skywalker went from driving a hovercraft on the desert to piloting an X-Wing in an attack on a heavily fortified space station without any visible training. “A New Hope” gives us no reason to believe Luke has any formal training or experience in piloting anything more than a hovercraft, but he somehow manages to do it — and do it well — on his first try. “The Force Awakens” at least gives us the pretense of Rey being knowledgable of starships and their inner workings through years of scavenging. I can believe she would have at least some basic-level knowledge of how to fly a starship if necessary.

Before you talk about how the writing for Rey is “bullshit” again, ask yourself if any criticism you can levy against her writing can also be applied to any other character in the franchise prior to “The Force Awakens”.

Oh, and one more thing while I have the time: Twister, “mehwell” is not a word. Stop trying to make up words; you are not Shakespeare.

Now let us all go get drunk on eggnog.
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47489
Anonymous
Well, it seems that the doctors managed to stabilize her condition and Carrie Fisher is better and considered out of emergency.
replyreportdelete
47490
Anonymous
>47483
>TFA was worse than each of the Prequel movies (even the Phantom Menace) from a story standpoint
It objectively wasn't.
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47491
Anonymous
>47488
> “A New Hope” gives us no reason to believe Luke has any formal training or experience in piloting anything more than a hovercraft

There actually is a line of dialogue that he knows how pilot some sort of flying ship (I think the name is T16), and that he has good aim with it.

Also, while it is true that he was flying an X-Wing, he didn't take a lightsaber to an actual combat and didn't outright start using force powers unassisted in that short time span. I don't think Rey is a mary sue or something like that, but saying that she wasn't quite above the level of competence as Luke simply isn't true.
replyreportdelete
47492
Mister Twister
Goddammit, did Carrie really have to have a brush with death just before 2017?

Fucking Hell, man.....
replyreportdelete
47493
Mister Twister
>47491
Looks like someone paid attention while watching ANH. Yes, they said but not showed, that Luke was known as a great pilot with great aim.

Wish they showed. But on on that budget...
replyreportdelete
47494
Anonymous
>47493

He way playing with a model of a T-16 in his garage and had that long rifle that the Sand People broke.

So we got a few good bits.
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47495
Mister Twister
savepng554.608KB
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>47494
Glad at least some people liked the 3 seconds of Luke playing with his toy plane.
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47499
Anonymous
>47495
>47493
>Wish they showed but on that budget...
That's no excuse for bad storytelling. Saying the budget excuses vague and blink-if-you'll-miss-it expo dumps to set up a character's abilities is like saying Manos the Hands of Fate was a good movie hampered by a bad budget.
replyreportdelete
47500
Anonymous
>47499

>comparing A New Hope to Manos
>saying A New Hope is bad storytelling because they refer to a skill using dialogue

Wew, lad.

Hey, here's a fun exercise, why does Rey initially reject her call to the hero's journey? You know, that essential stage that communicates the risks involved in the Journey by illustrating what the Hero will have to sacrifice or make changes to? Luke has an actual reason that the audience can relate to, his ties to his family farm, the only home he's ever known. Sure he wants to leave with Ben and go on a crazy amazing space adventure, but he also feels the weight of responsibility. Rey has... uhhhhhhh.....!??!??? She might ACTUALLY find out what happened to her parents after they left her on Not-Tatooine? Maybe she just really fucking liked that not-bread they paid her in? And before one of you fuckers say "We'll find out in the next film!" NO. FUCKING STOP. You include at least a fake reason for the audience to latch onto or something that you plan to introduce a twist on later, you don't just have FUCKING NOTHING.

You don't even have to have a Refusal of the Call. They included it in TFA because they were badly aping A New Hope without understanding the underyling Hero's Journey theory that went into the story. That's the major problem with TFA. It is a surface-level copying of storytelling mechanics, with no understanding of WHY you include them.
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47501
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47500
If her parents come back to Jakku and she's not there, she might never know who she is or where she came from. That you actually said this before the stale bread quip shows that TFA handled its exposition and its refusal of the call perfectly well.

Again, it's not a competition. They're not better or worse than each other, enjoying one doesn't obligate you to hate the other, they're just different, and that's fine.
replyreportdelete
47502
Anonymous
>47500
No matter how profile an artifact of culture might be, it's not above criticism. The fact is that they used showing rather than telling to establish a character's skill in an area that would be vital later, and that's sloppy, no matter how many nerds have masturbated to Princess Leia in a slave outfit. The fact that you're so quick to go to bat to it with no actual defense for it other than that "It's A New Hope!" is pretty strong evidence that you're blinded by nostalgia rather than arguing from a good faith position.
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47503
Anonymous
>47502
Clearly I shouldn't post this late at night. It's supposed to be "no matter how high profile", and "The fact is they used telling rather than showing."
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47504
Anonymous
Risking joining the argument but... in what manner did they "show not tell" that Rey could be a skillfull starship pilot, before she took the helm of the Falcon and started doing all those crazy maneuvers and outsmarted actual trained pilots? If A New Hope is bad because of it, then the same applies to TFA.

Funny enough, this is actually averted in Phantom Menace. Lil' Anakin IS shown to possess some skill (being a racing pilot in a very hostile circuit, as opposes to just using a hover vehicle for transportation like Luke and Rey do), and when he does get his hands in a fighter... he doesn't really do anything THAT extraordinary with it.
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47505
Mister Twister
>47504
In TFA, if my memory serves me correctly, Rey says she never flown a SPACEplane before.

Which means no prior experience.

But who needs experience when you can have THE FORCE?
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47506
Anonymous
>47504
Rey's starship piloting skills weren't key to the climax of the movie. The scenes where they showed off her piloting skills were the sorts of scenes Luke needed to have in ANH before doing the Death Star run.
replyreportdelete
47507
Anonymous
>47506

why did the scene involving her doing absurd stunts in the star destroy graveyard exist in the first place?

Oh yeah, cuz "we need an action beat" here.

It adds all sort of ridiculous incoherent elements to the story too. What, they sent two tie fighters after an escaping ship and then... nothing? Huh? What? They don't even make the jump to light speed after leaving the planet. What on earth is Kylo Ren or the first order even /doing/ during that time? At least in A New Hope they just avoid any entanglements other than ground troops and then blow out of the area at light speed before the Empire can send a TIE fighter squadron off at them.
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47508
Anonymous
savejpg7.49KB
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>47501
>If her parents come back to Jakku and she's not there, she might never know who she is or where she came from.

That motivation makes absolutely no fucking sense, unless Rey is the reincarnation of Seymour. Good grief. Nobody is going to be able to relate to that motivation. It's nonsense.
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47509
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47508
So in your universe, adoptions don't exist and no child has ever had an absentee parent. Okay, gotcha.
replyreportdelete
47510
Anonymous
>47509
I kinda get what he means, plus she could simply leave a holo-thingie at home or tell somebody in Jakku "if some fellows ask for me, tell them i'll be at X". It's an universe with FTL communications and where everybody can go to one side to the other of the galaxy with ease, that sort of problem should be a non-issue.

Personally, I simply take Rey's refusal as her being afraid to leave home, shitty as Jakku was that's all she knew.
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47515
Anonymous
>47509

Interesting you bring that up because Luke has both of those, but his backstory is crafted in a way to explain how he's been able to survive in such a harsh climate (Taken in by his uncle and aunt) and develops what few ties he has to his adoptive home. Rey has ffffffffffuuuuuucking nothing. I would love to have seen some more development and some explanation of how she ended up on Jakku, who took care of her (or how on earth she took care of herself), maybe develop what gave her the seemingly unwaveringly belief that her folks were coming back for her, and gladly sacrificed a useless action beat of the Falcon flying with TIE fighters or Han Solo being chased by giant alien squids to get such information.
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47516
Anonymous
>47515
Any kind of Parental figure seeing her off or knowing Abrams massive fanfiction bent being killed off by first order would have sufficed. Hell even something showing them and just information that that died a few years prior would have worked.
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47517
Anonymous
>47515
>some explanation of how she ended up on Jakku, who took care of her (or how on earth she took care of herself)
we saw all of these things
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47518
Alpharius
http://people.com/movies/carrie-fisher-dies/

With only a few days left, 2016 still doesn't stop.
replyreportdelete
47519
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47518

GODFUCKINGDAMMIT.
replyreportdelete
47521
Anonymous
>47518

God dammit 2016, you really are a Cursed Year.
replyreportdelete
47522
Anonymous
America no longer deserves to have icons like her I guess.
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47523
Mister Twister
Well......... she did say "certain politician only wins over my dead body"........... did she curse her fate?
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47524
Anonymous
>47523
Shut up you worthless ass.
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47526
Anonymous
So with all her scenes already shot for the next film. What now?
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47527
Anonymous
Hearing some sources that she never regained consciousness after the incident which is never a good sign. Damn shame. Wish them the best and all.
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47528
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47523

Twister, you can be a complete imbecile at times. This is one of those times.
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47529
Anonymous
>47523

Don't worry, I laughed, Twister.

and before you guys come at me for saying I'm /pol/ or Trump or whatever, I voted Hillary, I just have a sense of humor.
replyreportdelete
47530
Mister Twister
>47528
She did say it though.
replyreportdelete
47531
Anonymous
>47526
>What now?

I bet somebody involved thought "CGI" upone considering that question.

Hopefully, that very same person slapped him/herself hard afterwards.
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47532
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47531
I assume they'll do what was done with Oliver Reed in Gladiator, using clever editing and digital inserts to grant her a heroic death scene. As with Heath Ledger's Joker they'll want to preserve as much of her performance as possible.
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47536
Anonymous
>47531
Only CGI I'd accept is Paul Walker style headswapping.
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47537
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47536

Disney literally did that in "Rogue One" for Tarkin and Leia.
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47538
The Sneaky Tiki
Rey and Luke snap to attention, sensing through the force Leia has died, their training had finished and Rey was already trying to convince Luke to return. This provides the push he needed.

They go back for the giant multiple planets wide celebration of her life/mornful funeral and through out the movie we hear Rebel forces speak of her saintly work and how she never recovered from the grief of Han's death.
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47539
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47538

Somewhere on Tatooine, those who had been loyal to Jabba the Hutt hear word of the Huttslayer's demise and celebrate.
replyreportdelete
47540
The Sneaky Tiki
>47539
Kylo Ren feels the pull of the light side even stronger as he secretly grieves the destruction he's caused while cursing himself for being so weak.
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47541
Mister Twister
savepng106.401KB
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47542
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47541

I did not mean it as a complete joke, you know. "Huttslayer" is a canonical nickname for Leia as of this year.

http://nerdist.com/new-star-wars-novel-brings-the-huttslayer-nickname-for-princess-leia-to-canon/
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47543
Anonymous
I am not entirely sure "loyal to Jabba the Hutt" is something that actually existed in the SW universe. I mean, in context, Leia's Hutt-Slayer moniker is congratulatory.
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47546
Anonymous
>47543
Well not on Tatooine as other crime lords flowed into fill the gap but if she went into Hutt controlled space that would be a different.

To that note I'd liked to see Nar Shadda and Nal Hutta

Maybe get a little of that in the Solo film.
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47547
Mister Twister
Everyone needs to see it:
//youtube.com/watch?v=mjHEHuNyvMEyoutube thumb
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47548
Anonymous
//youtube.com/watch?v=upN-7ALj2OUyoutube thumb
New Star Wars Rebel trailer.
Getting hype for Old Obi-Wan
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47549
Mister Twister
>47548
I did not want that, but guess I don't mind if they execute it well.

Judging by their track record, I say they most likely will.
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47550
Anonymous
>47548
I know this is supposed to be straight up Star Wars The Series

But man its ugly.
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47551
Alpharius
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720480
I'm slowly burning through cgi Clone Wars. I am still amazed at how season 1 was bad, but had a good finale. And season 2 has been on average, good. I was not expecting a really well done Godzilla parody. That came out of nowhere.
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47552
Anonymous
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>47550
Its a strange esthetic. Mixture of McQuarrie and Tartakovsky styles and designs.
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47553
Mister Twister
savegif998.235KB
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After finally seeing Rogue One in the cinema, had a weird conversation with a human being who believes that Star Wars movies don't have to make sense, and you just turn your brain off and enjoy the spectacle. Cause "that's what fiction is really about". When I told them "Well, that's just how you see it", got a response "No, it is a fact".

That human being was much older than me.
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47554
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47553

It's a matter of perspective, really. And his is all wrong.
replyreportdelete
47555
Alpharius a go go
>47553
Going to the movies with elemetary schoolers is just asking for problems.

But in all seriousness, I'm doubtful this person watched Empire Strikes Back.
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47556
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47553
Every movie has inconsistencies, your capacity to forgive them is directly proportional to the movie's aesthetic quality. If you're spending inordinate energy nit-picking a movie, it's because the movie failed to grab you on an emotional level and you're looking for reasons why in the plot itself rather than the cinematography framing it.

Which isn't to say that your colleague was 100% correct, since nothing in critical analysis ever is, but creating a spectacle that an audience will happily switch their brains off for is a lot harder than it sounds.
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47557
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47556

>If you're spending inordinate energy nit-picking a movie, it's because the movie failed to grab you on an emotional level and you're looking for reasons why in the plot itself rather than the cinematography framing it.

Or you are part of the team behind CinemaSins. [ding]
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47558
Mister Twister
>47555
The person in question thinks Empire is the best.

And if asked why, would probably give me a logical explanation, which would frame them as a hypocrite (which they probably are).
replyreportdelete
47559
Anonymous
>47558
Is this friend of yours aware that you are calling him/her an hypocrite over Star Wars?
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47560
Mister Twister
>47559
No, not really a friend, a much older person who thinks they're very smart when in fact they are quite dumb.

Okay, really tired of THEYing, might as well stop now.
replyreportdelete
47582
Anonymous
Why are people still bitching about the Star Wars EU no longer being canon? Those stories aren't going away. People care way too much about what's canon instead of what's good. There are people around me who watch the individual DC cinematic shit not because they like it, but because of how it ties into the overall universe, so they feel like they HAVE to watch it.

/rant
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47583
Mister Twister
>47582
What is officially canon is serious business.
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47596
Anonymous
>47582
>47583

Not like things aren't being added back in. We've already gotten some ships back in along with planets and one of the major players. They just tossed it all to start because to be honest it was a fucking shitshow.
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47598
Anonymous
>47596
Let's just say this:

If they "add back in" the Thrawn Trilogy (with some cosmetic rewrites), and KOTOR 1&2, that would please me very much.
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47602
Anonymous
>47598
I liked that people were griping that Thrawn didn't seem as artistically minded as before. Till it was pointed out he had a the bottom of his Star Destroyer painted up with a mural.

Also Timothy Zahn is writing a book that will be in new canon so that'll catch everything up.
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47603
Anonymous
>47602
>Also Timothy Zahn is writing a book that will be in new canon so that'll catch everything up.
If it does not retcon TFA, I am not interested.
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47606
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47603
>retcon a critically-acclaimed movie that's made Disney more money than god
What on earth made you think that was even a prospect?
replyreportdelete
47607
Anonymous
>47606
I never said I believe that would happen.

Doesn't stop me wanting for that.
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47614
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
"Episode VIII" has a title: "The Last Jedi".
replyreportdelete
47615
Mister Twister
>47614
No doubt to reference Yoda's line from Ep6.
replyreportdelete
47616
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47614
Plus a sinister-looking red font instead of the traditional gold, hearkening back to those "Revenge of the Jedi" teaser posters.
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47620
Mister Twister
savepng1.7MB
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19201090
Everywhere, the sand gets.
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47621
Alpharius
savejpg42.939KB
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>47614
Luke confirmed for dying before he can train Rey and Kylo gets no redemption.

Also, what is the possibility that Disney hard reboots the prequel trilogy? I think after they get done with the new trilogy and Boba Fett they have a pretty high chance going back to the prequels.
replyreportdelete
47622
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47621

>what is the possibility that Disney hard reboots the prequel trilogy?

None. They cannot go back in time and undo the creation of the Prequel Trilogy. They cannot undo the canonicity of the Prequel Trilogy, shitty as it is, without enduring the wrath of "Star Wars" fans over yet another major change to the canon. They probably already have vague plans for continuing the franchise after Episode IX, too. Why would Disney try to remake the Prequel Trilogy when there is little-to-no benefit in doing so?
replyreportdelete
47623
Anonymous
>47621
"Jedi" is both a singular and a plural, so the title doesn't necessarily have to mean that.
replyreportdelete
47624
Anonymous
>47621
>Also, what is the possibility that Disney hard reboots the prequel trilogy?
I won't give a fuck.
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47625
Alpharius
savegif2.728MB
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>47622
>They cannot go back in time and undo the creation of the Prequel Trilogy.
Yes, but they can always reboot it. I don't want to start another long discussion about reboots, but reboots are done for a reasons and I think that Disney could explain it off as "cleaning house" or "rebuilding Star Wars for the fans".
>They cannot undo the canonicity of the Prequel Trilogy
Ah, but I thought that the prequal trilogy was already tossed in the Legends bin, not that I care/know about current canonicity. And if JJ can toss midiclorians out, why not more?
>without enduring the wrath of "Star Wars" fans over yet another major change to the canon.
"Star Wars" fans have already survived the prequel trilogies and the whole Legends... thing, I doubt that fans will not go to a Star Wars film with the rebooting of the much maligned/panned prequel trilogy.
>Why would Disney try to remake the Prequel Trilogy when there is little-to-no benefit in doing so?
>little-to-no benefit
While I agree that just moving forward with just running with the franchise and not looking back, it's Star Wars. If the prequel trilogies made more money [in the box Office] than the original trilogy [source http://www.the-numbers.com/movies/franchise/Star-Wars#tab=summary ] then remaking the prequel trilogy can only result in more money, right? I'm a little surprised you didn't slippery slope me with something about Disney remaking the original trilogy. All Disney has to do is out live enough Star Wars fans that care about the integrity of the OG trilogy
replyreportdelete
47626
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47625

>they can always reboot it

You mean "remake" it. There is no "reboot" to be had here. And Disney will neither reboot nor remake the entire goddamned Skywalker storyline just so Episodes 1 to 3 of the main "Star Wars" storyline do not suck.

>I thought that the prequal trilogy was already tossed in the Legends bin

The last time I checked, the Prequel Trilogy still exists, and I have not heard of the new Grand Poobahs of "Star Wars" saying the movies are not canon and should not "count". (They may be ignored by future filmmakers and storywriters, but that is not the same as saying they are not canon.) If you have proof that Disney has completely disavowed the Prequel Trilogy to the point of disowning all three movies, feel free to offer that proof. Until you can do that, you can consider the Prequel Trilogy as canon.

>remaking the prequel trilogy can only result in more money, right?

You do realize that the Prequel Trilogy movies had higher box office takes because of a rise in ticket prices and the franchise's increased prominence in pop culture, right?

And yes, there is a distinct possibility that a Prequel Trilogy remake could make more money for Disney. But again: What the hell would be the point besides pure corporate greed? (And that would be the only reason for a Prequel Trilogy remake.)

You can wish and hope and pray and suck every Disney executive's dick for the next decade, but none of that will make any wish for a Prequel Trilogy remake come true. If Disney had any plans for remaking the Prequel Trilogy, why have they not announced such plans already? I mean, if you really believe "Star Wars" fans are aching — begging, even! — to see a Prequel Trilogy remake and Disney would want to make those fans happy no matter what, why would Disney start their dips into the "past" with "Rogue One" or the Young Han Solo movie?

Only a comparative handful of "Star Wars" fans might — might — want a Prequel Trilogy remake. What sucks for them is how the opinions of that handful of fools are not nearly enough to sway the plans of a multi-billion-dollar international media conglomerate.

And Disney will never remake the Original Trilogy. No one will. Those movies are like "Citizen Kane" or "The Godfather", in that their reputation and importance to pop culture will ensure that they will never get a direct remake. This was, in part, the reason why "Ghostbusters" withstood so many different attempts at reboots and remakes until the one we got — and, in part, why the "Ghosbusters" rebake was widely reviled by general audiences. Some movies just cannot and should not be remade, and some franchises cannot and should not be rebooted. "Star Wars" is one of the latter, and the Original Trilogy are three of the former. The major roles of those films may be recast for movies set during the time of the Original Trilogy and the New Trilogy, and that would be both understandable and acceptable — but the Original Trilogy is too culturally "untouchable" to ever be remade.
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47629
Alpharius
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>47626
I guess I should have said "remake" over "reboot", but you understood what I was trying to say. I guess the prequel trilogy being tossed was me just remembering stuff wrong. I don't really want the prequel trilogy remade as badly as you think I do, it was just a though I had after remembering that Young Han Solo, Yoda and Boba Fett are all getting movies. Disney has the final say on canon, but I think they might allow directors and writers a little wiggle room. But as I said earlier, I never cared about what is and isn't canon.

Source for JJ's opinion on midichlorians ==> http://www.slashfilm.com/jj-abrams-midi-chlorians/
>I will just say this: I would never presume to question anything George Lucas says is canon in Star Wars. And our job was not to negate or undo. A lot of people who are critics of our Star Trek, and I respect all of them, said we destroyed what they loved and negated everything. And we worked hard to clarify that we are not saying that our Star Trek over-rides a thing of the original Star Trek — it was a parallel timeline. I never wanted to negate canon that fans held so dear. And because I love Star Wars and have for too many years… … And having said all that and meaning it — I don’t want to presume over-write or change what George says the rules are.

>I’m not someone who quite understands the science of the Force. To me Star Wars was never about science fiction — it was a spiritual story. And it was more of a fairytale in that regard. For me when I heard Obi-Wan say that the Force surrounds us and binds us all together, there was no judgement about who you were. This was something that we could all access. Being strong with the force didn’t mean something scientific, it meant something spiritual. It meant someone who could believe, someone who could reach down to the depths of your feelings and follow this primal energy that was flowing through all of us. I mean, thats what was said in that first film!

>And there I am sitting in the theater at almost 11 years old and that was a powerful notion. And I think this is what your point was, we would like to believe that when shit gets serious, that you could harness that Force I was told surrounds not just some of us but every living thing. And so, I really feel like the assumption that any character needs to have inherited a certain number of midi-chlorians or needs to be part of a bloodline, it’s not that I don’t believe that as part of the canon, I’m just saying that at 11 years old, that wasn’t where my heart was. And so I respect and adhere to the canon but I also say that the Force has always seemed to me to be more inclusive and stronger than that.
replyreportdelete
47630
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47629

Yes, this is pretty much what I was talking about: The new films cannot override the canonicity of the Prequel Trilogy, but that does not mean new filmmakers will be forced to reference Episodes 1 to 3. I would imagine that, since the Skywalker saga appears to be nearing its end, references to the Prequel Trilogy will be few and far between, if they even happen at all.

And I doubt the films will ever get into "the science of the Force" again. That was one of Episode 1's biggest missteps, and it is telling that the following two films never really reference midichlorians again.
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47631
Anonymous
I didn't mind the concept of the Midichlorians as much as the sillyness of sticking numerical numbers to signify less and more powerful Jedi, DBZ style.
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47632
Anonymous
>47629
>Disney has the final say on canon
Which is why I don't care anymore. Once Rebels is over, I'm off the ride.
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47633
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47631
The last arc of The Clone Wars made a conscious effort to "re-mystify" the Force, Midichlorians and all. I believe the implication was that the Jedi had grown so technocratic and bureaucratised in the last days of the Republic that they'd grown to see the Force in the same terms. Yoda came to see the error in this, which is why the Midichlorian talk fell into disuse in the original trilogy.
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47641
Anonymous
>47633
Your interpretation.
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47642
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47641

It's a matter of perspective, really.
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47643
Mister Twister
>47642
From your point of view :P
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47703
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
https://io9.gizmodo.com/the-new-star-wars-aftermath-novel-reveals-the-pitiful-1792481018

This is…this is actually a little depressing. I mean, yeah, I disliked Jar-Jar and all, but good lord.
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47704
Anonymous
>47703
It's kinda pathetic. Yes, nobody likes the character, but that was almost 18 years ago. Just forget it, no amount of shitting on Jar Jar will make "right" him being part of the franchise.
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47705
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
On a whim, I looked up the Darth Vader bit from "Rogue One", and the film's ending was in the "related videos" sidebar.

Even in a camrip (though admittedly a damn good one), the uncanny valley nature of CGI Leia was all too apparent. If that shot had been maybe a couple seconds shorter, the effect might not have been as noticeable.

But hey, judge for yourself (while the video is still up): //youtube.com/watch?v=TfcHJw-6sHkyoutube thumb
replyreportdelete
47706
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
Oh, and incidentally:

>47623

Foreign-language versions of "The Last Jedi" subtitle have confirmed that "Jedi", in this context, is indeed a plural.
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47707
Anonymous
>47706
Wasn't that evident in english? Palpatine reffers to the whole bunch of them as "the Jedi", not "Jedis"
replyreportdelete
47708
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47707

It was not. "Jedi" is both singular and plural, and Luke seems to be the last remaining (proper) Jedi in the galaxy. Thus, the number of Jedi referred to in the subtitle — one or at least two — was a minor mystery until people learned about the foreign-language subtitles.
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47709
Anonymous
By the way if you guys aren't in the mood for eating right now go look up the "Decraniated".
replyreportdelete
47710
Anonymous
>47709
>Decraniated

Yea and people thought Lobot had it bad.

Also new book is bringing in some stuff about Sheev along with that Jar Jar. Bringing back his hidden bases that he had all over the place in EU along with a listening post for things in the unknown regions
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47712
Anonymous
savejpg470.725KB
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So cast photo from Red Cup. Any word on who is playing whom. Woody I'd nail as Hans asshole of an uncle.
replyreportdelete
47713
Mister Twister
>47712
>we killed Han
>but don't worry, we'll give you more Han!
replyreportdelete
47714
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47712
I believe Harrelson will be playing Han's mentor. That is the most rampant speculation I had heard, anyway.

>47713
We are getting Donald Glover as Lando. I will accept a "Young Han Solo" movie if that is part of the bargain.
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47715
Anonymous
I wonder who the guy in the upper right of the pic could be playing.
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47716
Anonymous
>47715
Tis a mystery for sure.
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47717
Alpharius
>47715
I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess love interest.
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47718
Anonymous
>47712
Guessing one of those gals will be the Rebel Predecessor he had a thing with for a bit back in the day.
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47719
Anonymous
>47712
Let's hope Emilia Clarke doesn't have anything important to do.
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47778
Mister Twister
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720418
I am happy as fuck over how the Rebels writers finished the whole Maul thing. If I had chosen the path of writer, and gotten pretty darn good at it, I could not have written it better.

Made me feel things.
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47779
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47778

Quick recap, plz?
replyreportdelete
47780
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47779
The entire misstep of resurrecting Maul was worth it just for this one scene.

The entire episode is buildup to the encounter between Obi-Wan and Maul around the campfire. Obi-Wan begins in his traditional stance, then shifts into the stance Qui-Gon took in TPM. Maul moves to counter it with the same trick he pulled on Qui-Gon, only for Obi-Wan to slice through Maul's sabre and stab him in the chest. You're expecting some big choral-backed climactic shit but the entire fight is literally two swipes and it's done. Obi-Wan cradling dying Maul in his arms lasts longer, as Maul alludes to the young Jedi Obi-Wan is protecting and says "he will avenge us."

It's like poetry, it rhymes.
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47791
Alpharius
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spoiler
If you open this, you might cry.
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47792
Mister Twister
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>47791
Death is a natural part of life.
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47794
Anonymous
>47792
See, never liked that rationale, that death isn't bad and should be fully accepted because it's natural. Rain is also natural, and yet people invented umbrellas! Someday we will also invent a way to get around it, and I doubt that many won't take it just because mom nature says they should die.
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47795
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>47794

Yeah, and when you come up with this fancy immortality thing that lets people survive everything from car accidents to The Sixth Extinction, you let us know, okay? Until then: Everything that has a beginning has an end.
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47796
Mister Twister
>47795
And that is not even touching the overpopulation that would happen speedily.
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47800
Alpharius
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The Philosophy of Kreia: A Critical Examination of Star Wars
//youtube.com/watch?v=aCfQbV3jI8Uyoutube thumb
Major Knights of the Old Republic II spoilers, obviously.
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47865
Anonymous
//youtube.com/watch?v=zB4I68XVPzQyoutube thumb
First trailer for The Last Jedi has dropped y'all.
Who wants to bet that last line turns out to be a total fakeout?
replyreportdelete
47866
rasputin_zeroe9Z+3lbULwW
>47865
I'm guessing Luke's come to the conclusion that building a "Jedi Order" is on a hiding to nothing - there's more to the Force than hiding away in a monastery being all superior and shit. That doesn't mean "no more light side Force users," just that that's no longer synonymous with "Jedi."
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47867
Anonymous
>47800
Well Bioware Austin is rebooting the series so we'll see what comes of that stuff.
replyreportdelete
47870
Anonymous
>47867
Not a KOTOR reboot, actually some sort of Destiny-esque spinoff set in the new canon.
replyreportdelete
47914
Mister Twister
They better announce the animating of the unmade season of The Clone Wars on the 4th, or else I will be less happy than I could potentially be.
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48028
Anonymous
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/han-solo-firing-what-happens-star-wars-movie-1015658

Wonder what the shake down was on this. They just wanted to make up a whole lotta things unconnected to the rest of the films. Which would work with a project like Rogue One but not something tied into direct canon. Course that's just an assumption based on their prior work.
replyreportdelete
48029
Anonymous
>48028
And now an update. They've tapped Ron Howard to replace them.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/star-wars-han-solo-movie-ron-howard-steps-direct-1015674
replyreportdelete
48030
Anonymous
And the whole rundown of the situation to cap it. Lord and Miller went off script in direction of the Han Solo film ignoring the direction of the film as a Wild West /Heist film going with a lot of improv and angling towards their more comedic tone material.

They tried to keep this on the down low from Disney until Lawrence Kasdan the screenwriter had enough and went up the ladder to Kathleen Kennedy who ordered a rough cut of the finished material. Upon that review, Lord and Miller were fired and now Ron Howard is heading things.

//youtube.com/watch?v=stSpTgujfksyoutube thumb

Midnight's Edge gives a good synopsis as well.
replyreportdelete
48031
Anonymous
>48030
As someone who actually didn't care for The LEgo Movie's style of humor that much, good riddance.
replyreportdelete
48032
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>48030

Sounds like the right decision. I liked “The Lego Movie”, but a Young Han Solo movie does not need that movie’s style of humor. Ron Howard directing it should turn out an interesting result, though.
replyreportdelete
48033
Anonymous
>48032
Maybe they can get a step towards that Spaghetti Western style that Hollywood keeps chasing and never fully realizing.

I'd say depending on how much of the Lord and Miller material will be scrapped they should look into Once Upon a Time in the West or My Name is Nobody. The latter uses a bit more humor so maybe that and other Terence Hill Westerns could give them something. Or if they just scrap the last four months and it only ever exists as that rough cut then go full Sergio Leone.
replyreportdelete
48034
Alpharius a go go
Oh no, I love space weasterns, but I don't want to have high expectations for young Han Solo. Going into the new Star Wars movies with low expectations has given me great success in actually enjoying them.

Also, I would suspect that the increase of comedy in young Han Solo might have been a response to complaints about Rogue One being too serious and dark. Have some complaints about Rogue One, but it's dark and serious tone were more beneficial for my enjoyment than detractors.
replyreportdelete
48035
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>48034

Well, that, and the “charming rogue” archetype that defines Han Solo’s character would feel a bit more at home in a more lighthearted film than one with a serious tone.
replyreportdelete
48036
Anonymous
>48035
Then we'd look towards the Terence Hill Trinity westerns. Where he's an aloof wiseass drifter with a quick hand and a heart of gold.

He'll rob bandits blind but help out those in need.

//youtube.com/watch?v=J78J-6PbhVoyoutube thumb

Be a great scene to emulate parts of for a game of Sabacc with Lando and Han.
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48044
Anonymous
>48034
The problem with Rogue One is that Star Wars is a children's movie franchise and it pretty was explicitly the older, nerdy audience. Which means it's becoming less like Star Wars and more like Star Trek. And directed by the same guy. A homogenization of the two major space opera franchises is not a good thing for people who like both series for different reasons, unless someone manages to revive Stargate SG-1 or Farscape into serious contenders.

Which is pretty unlikely.
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48045
Anonymous
>48044
>Star Wars is just for kids my man
Don't take George's words as gospel. Half of it is perfectly child-friendly, but to say SW is "for kids" is fucking lying.
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48046
Anonymous
>48044
The problem with Rogue One is that the character's were not worth crap. Forest Whitaker (I don't even recall his character's name) dies and I was like "so what". Then Jyn's dad dies and the same reaction, who gives a shit. Then everybody else dies in quick sucession, and I still got 0 emotional response because the movie never bothered giving me any reason for me to care.
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48047
Anonymous
>48046
I see you are a "don't care" type of person.
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48048
Anonymous
>48047
Nope. I cared quite a bit when Han died in Force Awakens. Also, even if they may not be my absolute favorites characters in the series, if any of the power trio died in the Last Jedi the movie would get at least a "awwww shucks" from me. It was a problem with Rogue One, not on my side.
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48049
Anonymous
>48045
>
>Don't take George's words as gospel. Half of it is perfectly child-friendly, but to say SW is "for kids" is fucking lying.
It's not *just* for kids, but it is certainly for kids. You are lying to yourself if you think Star Wars was ever anything but a children's movie with crossover appeal. That's like thinking Avatar: The Last Airbender wasn't "for kids."
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48050
Anonymous
>48049

I'd still go with George over Abrams. And from the looks of things most of the production also is leaning towards that.

They've apparently asked George for all his notes and what his plans were and are compartmentalizing "working around" Abrams trash.
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48051
Anonymous
>48047
This was a common complaint about Rogue One by critics, actually--darkness-induced viewer apathy, and the fact that the narrative didn't actually give you any REASON to give a shit about any of the people who died. They gave us scenes that are "supposed" to gain sympathy for characters from the audience, without actually putting in the story work to earn that sympathy. Which isn't even a question of time, it's just a question of the skill and heart of the people writing it--Pixar, for example, managed to create huge sympathy for Carl and Ellie in Up in the course of about three minutes just by showing a quick series of scenes of them being happy together so that we appreciated what had been lost and why it should be emotionally devastating.

Killing a few characters isn't enough to give a story emotional torque. You have to show who that character was, make the audience care about them, like them if possible, and then show the emotional devastation their death makes on survivors. To be fair, it's not like Star Wars has done a fantastic job of this even in the classics--Obi Wan's death wasn't particularly saddening, and while Yoda's was a little bit sadder because of how much more human his death was (and because we had come to actually care about the Jedi Traditions and the fact that Luke's training would now never be complete), it was really only Vader's death that had any real emotional torque from a character perspective--and that's because Vader's redemption had become at least 80% of Luke's character arc at that point. If we had not been made to care about Luke's quest to prove his father's humanity by seeing why he came to do so and why it was important to him, the fact that Vader turned on the Emperor would've been tedious.

Which is why they're going to have to be awfully careful with how they handle Kylo Ren's character in the new trilogy. He doesn't deserve redemption based on his own character--the only way to make the audience actually give a shit about seeing him redeemed (other than the random fans that every edgy "bad boy" gets) is to tie his redemption into the arc of someone we actually care about. Which means probably either Luke's or Chewbacca's arcs, since real life has written the plot on Leia's involvement, sadly, and the actual focus characters of the arc, Rey, Finn, and Poe, have no reason to give a shit about Kylo.
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48052
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>48051

>Killing a few characters isn't enough to give a story emotional torque.

This is the kind of moment where I like to bring up the Eight Deadly Words of Storytelling: “I don’t care what happens to these people.”
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48079
Mister Twister
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replyreportdelete
48109
Mister Twister
savejpg479.884KB
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Star Wars: the only franchise where the question "What's your favourite ship?" means something completely different.
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48110
Anonymous
>48109

Damn Skippy. Wish they hadn't nixed the 4 inch Black Series for those "Retro" style figures.

I'd have loved a highly articulated figures for those vehicles.
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48138
Anonymous
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... OK
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48140
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>48138

…why is Han Solo now a furry animal of some sort?
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48142
Anonymous
>48138
I don't care how toyetic they are, I love these stupid things.
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48145
Anonymous
>48140
If the leak is true then Anakin reincarnated in a Force Sloth, then perhaps Han came back as a Force Hamster
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48150
Anonymous
savejpg84.68KB
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640360
>48140
>48145
Hamsters are known to be good space pilots.
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48167
Alpharius
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960540
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48201
Anonymous
Looks like they got rid of Colin Trevorrow for IX. Good riddance based on what I've heard about his newest film.
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48202
Anonymous
>48201
Have they said who's going to take over?
replyreportdelete
48203
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>48202

Not yet, but I have to wonder: How will this affect the future of other white male directors in Hollywood?
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48204
Anonymous
>48203
Clearly it means they're going to replace him with Josh Trank.
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48205
Anonymous
>48201
>Good riddance based on what I've heard about his newest film.

Book of Henry? I watched that, and it was indeed quite shit. The film starts with a strange kinda-cutesy-but-there-is-rape premise, but quickly goes into edgy nonsense, and ends in an anti-climax that makes you question what the fuck was the point of the whole thing.
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48206
Anonymous
>48205
I've heard it compared to The Room. Not on the same level but coming damn close in some aspects.
>48202


Some idiots want Abrams again. FUCK NO.
replyreportdelete
48207
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>48206

One popular suggestion on Twitter: The Wachowskis.

If I were in charge of the whole shebang, I would try to hire back whoever is directing The Last Jedi for continuity’s sake—but I would sure as fuck give a spinoff movie to the Wachowskis.
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48208
Anonymous
>48207
Why do people still want the Wachowskis to do anything? It's been 18 years since The Matrix, and they haven't managed to make anything that gets even close to that mark. I think it's time to accept that perhaps, they managed to catch lighting in a bottle ONCE, and won't ever do it again.
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48209
Anonymous
>48207
After Jupiter Ascending? HELL NO.
Seems like they're pretty happy with The Last Jedi so far so I like the idea of Rian Johnson just staying on, same way Marvel hired the Russos back for Civil War and the next Avengers.
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48210
Anonymous
>48208

The same could be said of M. Night Shyamalan and he still gets to direct feature films.
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48211
Anonymous
WILD IDEA:

Hire George Lucas to direct one of the spin-off films. I would like to see how he fares without being the supreme emperor in charge of everthing, and not being surrounded by yes-men.
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48212
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
https://www.polygon.com/2017/9/7/16268206/star-wars-the-last-jedi-rian-johnson

Well, that settles that.
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48213
Anonymous
>48211
George "The Idea Man" Lucas cannot fix the situation.

The only way to do, is to declare TFA non-canon and start over.

OH WAIT CARRIE IS DEAD AND HARRISON IS DONE WE CANNOT DO IT THEN.
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48214
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
>48213

>George "The Idea Man" Lucas cannot fix the situation.

…the fuck are you talking about? Nobody was saying anything like that, especially in that post. Th’fuck is wrong with you?
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48215
Anonymous
>48214
Probably a purist.
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48216
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
Abrams is back for Episode 9.
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48217
Anonymous
>48216
FUCK! FUCKING FUCK FUCKITY FUUUUUCK!

FUUUUUUUUUUCK!
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48219
Anonymous
>48216
Meh.
>48217
Meh.
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48220
Mister Twister
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48221
Alpharius a go go
>48216
Good. I hope he finishes the mystery box stuff he set up. But what do I know. I have such low expectations for Star Wars now. My one wish us that the new trilogy ends up finding it's owne identity in Last Jedi.
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48222
Anonymous
> Abrams Directing and Writing Episode 9

So yea the jokes about it being RoTJ redux have already started.

Because it fucking will be.
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48227
Anonymous
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>see that several of the major news sources are reporting HARRISON FORD FINALLY BREAKS SILENCE ABOUT AFFAIR WITH CARRIE FISHER
>read an article
>"I don't really feel that it's a subject that I want to discuss"
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48228
Mister Twister
>48227
This makes too much sense.
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48231
Anonymous
>48221
Fuck that you're gonna get five Death Stars next film.
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48235
Anonymous
>48231
Whole system is just Death Stars or some such nonsense with their sun being an incomplete but functioning one built out of ancient sith tech or something.
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48236
Anonymous
>48227
Harrison doesn't want to think about there being another person out there that he owes money to.
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48245
>48236
Harrison and Arnold's bastard spawns take over the Action Movie business.

Arnold's can and wants to and has been hanging out with dad. Because his legit kid is...yea.
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48257
Mr. StonezWb42fBPMM
And now, the legend of Willrow Hood:

https://danslvermillion.tumblr.com/post/165916074067/
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