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new Doctor Who thread?Anonymous
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Guess who's back, Back again~ Rani's back! Tell a friend~
Also, series 8 premiers on the 23rd of August
new Doctor Who thread?
Japanese Doctor Whoyoutube thumb

This is the greatest thing ever.
new Doctor Who thread?
That outfit is the best Doctor outfit.
So, the Doctor is Zubat now?
I read that as "Zubaz" now. A man can dream.
workprint for the first episode has leaked, it's in monochrome and the effects are missing and such.
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Oh, yeah, That'd explain it.
Had a little check: Moffat's scripts in Series 5-7 were edited by Lindsey Alford and Caroline Henry. They were often referred to as "Script Executives" rather than Script Editors, which if anything implies that they hold greater prestige under Moffat's tenure than they previously did.

new Doctor Who thread?
I'm ready for Capaldi.
Don't know anything about Doctor Who aside from Tumblr trickles (which frankly only makes me want to watch it less). Were these four episodes known for being particularly good or bad? I'm guessing it was the former, though pinning all the blame/praise women is an oversimplification.
The Sneaky Tiki
It's REALLY not, think of it like George Lucas syndrome, these women turned Moffat's shit stew into something worth watching, something incredible.

It is VERY, PAINFULLY clear that without them his work is an absolute mess with plenty of vision but zero direction bogged down by being so far up it's own ass.

I had forgotten how shitty the new Tardus looks, Jesus fuck that's so ugly.
>I'm guessing it was the former, though pinning all the blame/praise women is an oversimplification.

It's not that they were women, it's that they were good editors, and good at reigning him in. They were good at their jobs. The fact that they were women was pointed out more as a jab at how poetic it is that the people who made his work watchable were women given how poor his ability to write female characters is noted for being lately.
//youtube.com/watch?v=oXOBHnWiinYyoutube thumb

>Billy Hanshaw mocked up the above opening credits sequence after Peter Capaldi’s casting was announced, and according to the A.V. Club Steven Moffat liked it so much he “ask[ed] the BBC’s graphics department to make an official version.” Said Moffat: “It was the only new title idea I’d seen since 1963. We got in touch with him, and said, okay, we’re going to do that one.”

Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
Very cool, lots of nice retro bits to it.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
So how about that first episode.
Capaldi doesn't work as well with the oddball goofiness that Eccleston/Tennant/Smith had, and so like the first half of the episode, with him acting that way didn't work all that great to me. (Although the bit about the eyebrows was pretty funny)

Really hoping that they start drifting away from the now near standard "last minute spontaneous resolution" that Doctor Who has turned into. I'm hoping that mystery woman at the end turns out a better series linking plot than the last three or four.
The Sneaky Tiki
I honestly can't muster up the care.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
>Victorian Episode to start


That was the worst place to start that and the writing was complete pants.
The Sneaky Tiki
What do you expect with Moffat still stamped on this.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
I know its just really sad. Opening episode of New Doctor, yet has very little Doctor himself. I don't mind the Clue Crew really. Why do they reiterate every damn time what they are and have it take up a good portion of the episode. Believe we've been over their marriage three times now. Oh and that they are also ninjas.
I lost track of Doctor Who last mid-season, but the problems people are having with Steve Moffat aren't really different from what plagued Russell T Davies' run. Both had strong first season, but then slowly devolved in quality with each new season. Biggest problem with modern Doctor Who is portraying the Doctor as Space Jesus that everyone has to love regardless of what he's actually done. And than you have his companions that always fall for him, despite knowing him for five minutes. Donna's my favorite companion from the modern ere because she was just friends with the Doctor, and ironically, had the best chemistry for an actual relationship.

To get back to an earlier discussion here, the reason Moffat's episodes during Davies' run was stronger than his own run is simple: It's easier to produce high quality when you're only contributing one or two episodes. But I also have to ponder how much the quality on the show is impacted by BBC, because Moffat's Sherlock is obliviously stronger and tighter than his Doctor Who. (While Davies' Torchwood was just absolute shit, outside of Children of Earth.) I sometimes think Doctor Who being a kids show that thinks it's a adult program has limited the storytelling. Like how Amy could lose her child and then get over it like it's nothing.

Anyway, I'm glad to hear everyone is loving the new Doctor.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
I like him I think he has promise to be very classic kinda doctor, just a shame he was featured so little in his premier as I say
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
And here we almost got it again, would have really liked to switch companions with that girl and it to be "well its not the first time I've traveled with a Solider." not that silly answer he gave.

Didn't see the episode myself, but I always enjoyed story premises of one character going in the mind of another. Happy to hear the writers are finally backing off on the Doctor/companion sexual chemistry.
Remember how the Doctor used to be utter bros with soldiers like Jamie, the Brig, or Harry Sullivan?

Ah the glory days of when the Doctor had more than one Companion.
I would have liked Rusty the Dalek the Companion.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
Indeed, few times that has almost happened and to be cruelly ripped away from us.
The Sneaky Tiki
So just to kill some time I'm giving this a shot, but wow is it depressing that there is significantly less people even pirating the show.

I just realized the perfect analog to the series under Moffat, Bioshock Infinite, mediocre and so far up it's own ass it's embarrassing.
The Sneaky Tiki
They are trying but it's like fuck, we're just doing 9 to 10's arc again.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
Its like they want to go Classic Doctor with him, but then run away from the idea just as they get close.
Listen probably would have been a better episode if Moffat hadn't already pulled the "There is always something behind you" trick three times already.

Between the Vashta Nerada, the Weeping Angels and the Silence, the threat out of the corner of your eye has been well established by now. By the SAME FUCKING GUY.
The Sneaky Tiki
Yeah, he only seems to have rehash left in him, needs to leave the series REALLY bad.
>I'd go so far as to call this one of the best episodes of Doctor Who ever. There, I said it. Come at me, people.


>I like that, "deconstructing the heroism of the Doctor." Compared to this season, the themes of the Smith era were always in name only — "the Doctor must be forgotten (but not really)," "the Doctor's name is really important and should never be uttered (but it's okay if it does happen, really)." This season has been less explicit and more demonstrative with its theme (all for the better, I'd say). The Doctor performs acts of heroism but is himself still that scared little kid that never fit in with his own species.

>What makes this episode so compelling to me, and not unlike "Midnight" or "Silence in the Library," is that the villain is ultimately never seen. It never needs to be seen, really. What makes "Listen" even more impressive is that we didn't ultimately need a tangible antagonist with a weird name to sell the narrative. Fear itself, the concept, was enough. It wasn't some space dust that caused crazy hallucinations of some alter-Doctor-ego a la "Amy's Choice." It was simply fear... a very human emotion we rarely ascribe to heroes.


Still need to catch up here, but it sounds like the new season is heading in the right path, especially with everyone raving about "Listen." Even a friend I have that hasn't been loving the recent series said this episode nailed it.
It's my favorite episode since Midnight.
I really enjoyed Matt Smith's wacky adventures, but Capaldi's sort of more serious Doctor is going well. I like him better than Eccleston and Tennant already.
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y
I don't think calling this a rehash is at all fair. It's certainly in the same vein, but it's a pretty effective vein so I can't blame him for mining it some more. And it's extremely different from all three.

I'm actually enjoying this season quite a lot (even Robots of Sherwood which is definitely the weakest episode so far was good for some silly fun) although I'm a bit nervous that the metaplot is going to be crap. It's not very promising thus far.
I wasn't necessarily saying Listen was bad, just... worse for having the theme explored already. It was actually really good at setting up the tension, and was really well shot, but personally it suffered, particularly in the cold open, for being another story about things we can't really perceive right.
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Samuel Anderson is in my opinion the only good thing about Who right now.

Capauldi COULD be good but everything done with him already has been done already, it'll probably get better as they let him roll with it but for right now he's the hash-iest of rehashes.

Tiki you're clearly not going to enjoy the show until Moffatt is gone, why do you even watch it? I promise you, we will let you know when he's gone and it's safe to come out again.
Psychological analysis on the latest episode.

I do like that we've come back to her being more catalyst than companion.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
Little tired of super interesting characters we get to see and then..poof.
The Sneaky Tiki
Well, that was just kinda flaccid, like if this hadn't been the what, seventh time The Doctor has done this EXACT thing in the modern era it might have been good?
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
I'd really wish we could go classic and expand beyond doctor and one companion.
The previous reboot Doctors were never too keen to soldiers, but man this one is a real passive aggressive douche.
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I am actually really fucking sick of this lame moral grey shit, I like the Doctor being a hero who had to make tough calls at times but sometimes he worked out miracles.

I dunno, the show kinda feels, unadventurous? Like fuck, how many more times are they gonna go to fucking Victorian England?
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
That is the "cool" thing now. Doctor questioning if he's a good man and such. I mean I can see Nine pondering that. But we need to move on.
The Sneaky Tiki
If we're moving on then why has it been the same schtick for 2 Doctors in a row?
The Sneaky Tiki
Fuck that episode was kinda fun until the Doctor started to be a passive aggressive racist, Samuel Anderson remains the best thing about the show on the basis of what a cool guy pink is.
What is this twitch they've given him about soldiers?
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I have no clue but it's fucking stupid considering the Brigadier being almost the same character except white.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
And they were Bros. This whole "I dun like war, its bad n scary." But they've hooked into him has gone for too long.
Man, this series is just meandering and directionless, and the fact that the Doctor regenerated into an unprovoked dick isn't helping things.
The Sneaky Tiki
Remember when people thought Capauldi would be a breath of fresh air instead of the worst doctor ever?
There's only so much he can do with "Matt Smith's Doctor, but a jerk!"
Fuck. Fuck this episode. Fuck this episode.

It tried to be a fucking morality play but it was so hackneyed and unfair. Clara was fucking right at the end. Stupid, cheap, pathetic patronizing bullshit is what it was. "Oh, I can't help in this situation when I obviously have extra information that would affect all of humanity's decision but fuck you, you need to decide your own future without all of the known information" WHAT THE FUCK? Humanity made the "wrong decision" to want to kill the egg, but that was only because Earth was given limited information that the Doctor could have easily given. Does he think an uninformed decision could be the "right" decision? WHY did he have faith that Clara would make the "right" choice when she was as in the dark as the rest of humanity?

Oh, the "egg" disintegrated, convenient that billions of tons of rocks can simply disintegrate. Oh the new monster isn't going to attack, oh it LAID A NEW FUCKING MOON? SERIOUSLY? It laid a moon with what, the same exact mass as the original moon? FUCKING CONVENIENT BULLSHIT.
The Sneaky Tiki
So we were racist last episode I guess they decided to be sexist this episode.

Fuck what a terrible shit show I'm gonna give it one more shot before I give up on all of it.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
What has gone wrong!? I mean what is with all that nonsense.
The Sneaky Tiki
>What has gone wrong!?

Moffat has always been terrible, we've only just started to realize it because he's stuck around to long, he only actually has like, twelve episode that he just keeps remaking, a vague war, the choice to kill something that's probably not bad, whacky adventure that turns super cearial, etc lather, rinse, repeat.

I mean fuck sake the episode is called kill the moon and he cannot go the whole episode with referencing the episode lets kill Hitler since its complete recycle.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
First 12 Doctor Episode really put me off. Same fucking stupid god damn interactions with those three. Their interactions were established a long time ago Brute Butler, Ninja Mystery Wives Duo. Yet spend most the episode repeating that relationship.

And the base plot, fuck my head that was dim cyberman knockoff. And the Giant T-Rex topped it all I don't care if Vassy can wave it off with "I was there dear, I know how big" Makes my head hurt.
Am I the only person on the internet who actually likes this show?
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
Just wish they would let this Doctor be his own thing. Its like he gets close then they toss a whole bunch of other bits in as well.
My friend was just tweeting about how overtly critical fans are being with the latest season. She's been loving it so far. I still haven't caught up with anything, so I can't comment on the latest episodes.

But, honestly, modern Doctor Who has always been a bumpy ride in quality since season one. I think, when a Doctor Who episode gets something right, it ends up overshadowing all the mediocre episodes.
I haven't seen any of that at all. If anything, people are using Capauldi to indirectly give praise to Moffat.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
Blech, he's saving what crap writing he's given, though I dislike the Doctor as ignorant of Humans to this degree.

Think we'll get Pertwee for 13 hence his current role?
I still like it. I have criticisms, but I still enjoy it. I haven't been able to watch the past few episodes as I don't have BBC America or a computer, just a mobile device and the mobile quality is a bit crap.
I am liking Capaldi though. Yeah, the "not understanding humans" thing is a bit stupid at this point, but I still enjoy his performance and he channels my favorite Doctors; Three, Six, Seven, and Nine. I'm also really liking Clara and her character development.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
Also kinda wish didn't keep running into Xenophobic humanity even after alien encounter number hundred odd something. UNIT never seems to amount to a damn thing do they?
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//youtube.com/watch?v=DnPfZ-7uIJQyoutube thumb

The animation team behind Doctor Puppet are crowdfunding for a new video.

I really liked that episode. It was an interesting take on the Flatland concept, and a starkly dark contrast to how Space Dandy handled the same idea. Most of all, Clara as "the Doctor" was brilliant.
The Sneaky Tiki
I'm pretty sure you could kill yourself with a Doctor Who drinking game where the only rule is drink every time you hear "It's everywhere/all around/in the corner of your eye"

My eyes roll so far back in my head every time I hear that it gives me a headache, these nebulous threat enemies are all so fucking lame.
Meh, it's a matter of opinion. I have been liking this season so far.

That wasn't even this episode. You are literally just bitching for bitching's sake at this point.
The Sneaky Tiki
You are straight up wrong, in the intro the old man in the apartment STRAIGHT UP SAYS "THEY ARE EVERYWHERE" You are wrong, do I have to make a video of the scene to prove it?

Out of curiosity, did you stop watching at that point? Because otherwise you seem brain-damaged right now.
The Sneaky Tiki
Yeah, I cashed out my chips, it's pretty clear this a directionless series now, besides I said earlier in the thread this was my last shot.
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
Yea that is understood, its just random episodes tying to that background plot of Caretaker or something. Its not doing itself any favors. They should have gone back to the older style of episodes set into arcs. Running background theme is find but the way it is set up. It doesn't seem to matter at all.
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y
Wow I did not think much of this season's meta-plot at all but my mind just got changed enormously. I thought the big reveal twist of the episode (although still well-executed) was a bit ruined by the episode preview going CYBERMEN CYBERMEN CYBERMEN , but then it turned out that the Cybermen twist was just a red herring!
Been a fan since before the reboot, though I'm now in a weird situation where I'm starting to dislike the show, but I really like the current Doctor.

Like, what the heck was up with the science in Kill the Moon, or that tree one?

Kind of what them to get rid of Clara at this point and have Disruptive Influence as the companion instead.
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y
>what the heck was up with the science in Kill the Moon

The writer just wrote some off-the-cuff pseudo-science that made no sense just to get through it, made a note to come back and fix it, and then for some reason they decided to shoot with his first draft. That's my best guess.

The trees one didn't bother me so much because it made no pretense of being scientific.


I am unashamed to admit it, the hairs went up my neck. I think the show's still got it.
they dropped the ball putting cybermen all over the promos. the whole sneaky hints at cybermen and then "i feel like im missing something" then BAM the eye-doors and musical sting would have been the greatest OHSHIT moment of this series (And probably last one too)

Yep. Well, that's just Doctor Who previews all over, isn't it? Remember the ones for Army of Ghosts/Doomsday? At least this one held A twist back.
no. no i dont

i watched it here and there then marathoned 1-4 in the build up to season 5
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So it ends with Clara and Doctor getting nothing of what they wanted. Sad. And so so sappy. Love conquers cyberman technology, apparently.

Don't miss Santa Claus appearing mid-credits. Seriously, what am I supposed to take from this?
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM

That he's here to make sure Clara's gone for good? (One can hope, anyway.)
Bunker !OFOzVPOG0g
He'll be the center of this years special I'd wager.
The Sneaky Tiki

Moffat Who? Fucking garbage holy shit it's like David Cage game, all the DEEP nonsense just gets dumber and dumber as you revisit.
The Sneaky Tiki
And I'm speaking specically of his era as showrunner, not his being a writer.
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Seriously? Because there's a lot of trash writing in the Russell T Davies era.
The Sneaky Tiki
Yeah but it's fun trash, as opposed to boring trash, which is SOOOOOOOOOO MUCH WORSE.

Hence my David Cage comparison.
It is really not all fun trash.
The Sneaky Tiki
Sure it is, because I had fun watching RTD era, as Moffat came on the scene my fun lessened until I re-watched the Christmas special where Capauldi came in and and I literally feel asleep because it was so unbelievably lame and boring so boring oh god.

Then Capauldi's season just had me pissed because HOLY FUCK IS IT DIRECTIONLESS, I'm not even sure I finished watching it, like I remember parts but the entire season was a fog of sleepy anger for me, which given how the Doctor was written was apparently what he was feeling too.
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I really firmly disagree. There are great episodes in the RTD era for sure, but when it was bad? Oh my god it was bad on a level that the Moffat era could not possibly hope to reach. The worst I've ever felt in any Moffat era episode is bored. Some (and, frankly, a lot of them towards the end) RTD episodes had me jumping out of my chair in anger at just how bad they were.

I'm pretty well ready for Moffat to move on, and he has his flaws for sure, but either your idea of 'fun crap' is vastly different from mine or you're really whitewashing some of the seriously low points of his run in your memory.
The Sneaky Tiki
I just rewatched everything, how you feel about RTD is how I feel about Moffat.
>Some (and, frankly, a lot of them towards the end) RTD episodes had me jumping out of my chair in anger at just how bad they were.

When it came to creating "epic" sci-fi storylines, RTD would crumble hard. His best stories were usually the most reserved in scale. Even when his characters would be unbelievably cynical or jerk-ish.

Somewhat related, I still can't believe how hard RTD shit the bed with Torchwood. First and second seasons were "meh," but Children of Earth had real promise. Granted, the final episode of Children of Earth fucked it all up, but it doesn't diminish the dark and compelling atmosphere the miniseries had going. Miracle Day, however, was a serious regression. The series became nothing more than a melodramatic cartoon.
The Sneaky Tiki
I've never so much as glanced at Torchwood so that is probably a contributor to my opinion as that seemed to turn people RAW BITTER against RTD.
I haven't seen the third series, although I'm told that's the best one. Having suffered through the first two series of Torchwood I wasn't keen to subject myself to further crimes against television out of misplaced brand loyalty.
The Sneaky Tiki
That's how I felt about this season.
Go watch the first two series of Torchwood and get back to us as to what you think constitutes a "crime against television".
It really is the adult party cartoon of the Doctor Who franchise.
Way too over the top with the concept of an adult spin-off.
It's like a teenager on deviantArt's conception of what "adult" is supposed to be, it's the most embarrassingly childish vision of "mature" I've ever seen committed to screen with an actual budget and everything.

And then there was Sarah Jane Adventures, which was the exact opposite: a grown-up and intelligent children's show. And it was awesome! To this day I'm still baffled they were made by the same people.
I still don't know how Ianto goes from swearing to hate Jack forever for killing his true love to being Jack's true love.
I'm enjoying the show, especially this past season. I have my complaints about moffatt and my criticisms, but I don't hate the moffatt run or the Davies run (just certain episodes in them). I look forward to series 9. Also, it's probably never going to happen, but I would love if Big Finish got the rights to New Who.
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Sunny is back and it's getting even more impressive somehow.

Cricket somehow still manages to degrade into even more of a monster.
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>Disney XD airing Doctor Who

How horrible will this turn out?
The Sneaky Tiki
Depends if they air him fighting Satan or not.
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM


How much are they gonna cut to get all the commercials in?
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The Sneaky Tiki
Like, I'm trying to muster up the care but I haven't hated something as much as series 8 in....no, I never hated anything as much as series 8.

And the first episode of series 9 left a GODAWFUL first impression.
The Sneaky Tiki
So jumped in with The girl who died/lived.

I was like "why is this so much better than all the other episodes?"

Then I found out about Jamie Mathieson who apparently was the reason for the two episodes of series 8 I liked.

Fire Moffat, Hire Mathieson.
yea, that crap with Missy/Master I could have given no shits. Are we back to something not stupid or should I wait for this companion to go bye bye before coming back?
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y
Has Mark Gatiss ever written an episode of Who that was better than 'okay'?

I get physically ill when people propose him as a future showrunner.
Well, we've had a showrunner who's episode track record was "excellent."
Not sure if its completely indicative of quality of the running of the show.

It's not a one to one but since the showrunner inevitably winds up writing a lot of scripts, I think it's for the best that we go with a fellow who has actually demonstrated the ability to write a really good one.

To wit: Moffatt's writing has weaknesses that weren't apparent until his plotting was literally everywhere, but Gattiss hasn't demonstrated any notable chops at all in almost a decade of writing for the show.
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM
The Sneaky Tiki
That's a shame, not her fault she was written into one of the worst characters on the show.
She could have been written as a younger more keen to take the shit out of the Doctor Donna, or a Dalek Redeemed. Instead of a Maguffin
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y
I'm no big fan of Clara as a companion but I still think she deserved better than to go out with the most pointless main cast death in sci fi television since Tasha Yar.
I thought Face The Raven was moving and well-written, you heartless oiks.
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y
The only reason she died is because she did something pointless and stupid - and obviously, brazenly pointless and stupid, to the extent that it beggars belief that someone as intelligent as her wouldn't spot it as pointless and stupid unless she's literally just taking the big risk for its own sake. That suggests some deep pathology to her risk-taking that isn't supported by any of the other episodes of her run. Her justification for not consulting the Doctor about it felt particularly thin.

I can't even say that she did a stupid thing because the plot demanded it, because the plot pointedly did NOT demand it. It would be easier to swallow if the stupid thing she did had contributed in some way to the mystery's resolution in addition to getting her killed, but no: They solve the problem with time to spare. The chronolock switch is only relevant insofar as it leads to Clara's death.

There's a lot to like about the episode, even after the other shoe drops, mostly in Peter Capaldi and Maisie Williams' performances, but the blind idiocy of Clara's death wrecks the episode almost entirely.

(Also, I'm not the only one who felt that the shot of the bird flying into her was a bit tacky? You know the one that was basically jumping up and down screaming 'look at how big her boobs are, we highlighted them for you! Last chance for a wank before it's necrophilia, adolescent boys!')
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM

Clara will show up in the last (proper) episode of the season, “Hell Bent”, so maybe there will be at least some attempt at explaining why she did it there. At any rate, Clara's done as a character after this season, so no more worrying about Moffat's favorite Mary Sue!
Personally, I'm going to say I hope it isn't Clara, but another iteration of "The Impossible Girl" and that the Doctor just kinds of lets her be, and have a life that doesn't end in her getting horribly murdered in service of him.

Like, her death just now was so utterly pointless that it'd be nice to have a new one that just doesn't get involved at all.
The Sneaky Tiki
If I even BEGIN to care enough to even steal it I might agree with you.
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y

If her appearance is anything more than Karen Gillan's appearance in Eleven's regeneration scene, then this episode was a massive headfake from the writers and gets upgraded from 'sort of shit' to 'catastrophic tropical shitstorm'.
The Sneaky Tiki
Dude, as long as Moffat is in, he''l just make a new mary sue.
Y'know, guys, this pathological jadedness gets kind of tiring thread-in thread-out. We've had a surprisingly solid season with a Capaldi Doctor who's loosened up a great deal and become genuinely fun to watch, and a companion send-off that was both touching and shocking in its finality, and all you lot can do is whinge about that Dastardly Moffat and his Mary Sues.

Like, can you lot give the unbridled cynicism a holiday for one fucking episode?
This series hasn't been bad by any means, apart from Sleep No More and what I discussed above, but I'm not sure there's been a set of incredible episodes yet. There's been some great material (The Doctor and Davros' conversation, the whole setup of Under The Lake, Maisie Williams' performance) but it always comes with a caveat - The Sorceror's Apprentice wastes half its runtime on herrings so red they border on non sequiturs, The Girl Who Died is a bit weak and the lionman subplot in The Woman Who Lived is obvious and boring, Before the Flood's plotting gets muddled towards the end and the Fisher King's costume didn't look great walking around outside. The whole series has felt in need of refinement.

It's certainly better than, say, series four. Thank fuck.
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y

This was me btw.
The Sneaky Tiki
>become genuinely fun to watch

//youtube.com/watch?v=0oLSPhtg0YEyoutube thumb
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM
A decent rundown of how the show wasted Clara:

She had promise to be a younger Donna type, but no.
So! Heaven Sent!

Who woulda thunk that Peter Capaldi being chased down a corridor by a scary monster for 45 straight minutes would be so engaging?
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM

It probably wouldn't have been if not for Capaldi.
Honestly, it was a pretty strong script, stronger than most in the last like, 3 seasons? And it probably was strong from being written with defined limits - Doctor is alone, Doctor is in a boobytrap castle, video game rules apply.
Someone on another forum quipped that Moffat must have been playing Amnesia recently.

That's a good point about the limits helping the episode. Moffat excelled when discipline was imposed on him, so in imposing discipline on himself with this episode he's been able to tap into the qualities that qualified him for showrunner in the first place.
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y
That was a really good episode. The only weak thing about it was that it was hooked really strongly into the 'hybrid' thing, which is probably the weakest 'wink-wink-nudge-nudge look at us subtly namedrop something from the finale' in the history of New Who. This didn't hurt it a lot, because ultimately it really doesn't matter WHAT the secret is, just that it's some kind of secret that can absolutely never be told, but did nudge it down a little.

Now to see if Moffat can stick the landing.
Well, that could've been worse. But like so much of Capaldi's run so far it just kind of fell short of completely clicking because the Clara/12 relationship was never written strongly enough to really feel genuine in their first season together.

I really hope that come the next season, they work harder at developing a proper connection with whoever the new companion or companions end up being.
I dropped Dr Who after last season's finale with Missy but watched Heaven Sent due to you guys praising it and it was actually pretty good. I might just go back and marathon this season as well.
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM
Dear BBC: please fire Moffat when Capaldi leaves.

Sincerely, EVERYONE
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y
That finale was fucking great. It was like a gigantic middle finger stuck straight up in Journey's End's direction, I loved it.

Also, I am SUPER DOWN for that spin-off. Please, BBC, hear my prayers and give me at least a miniseries of Clara Oswald And Me's Adventures In Time And Space.
I'd be down for it too, but judging from the reactions I've seen on this thread a contingent of fans would likely burn Auntie to the ground if Clara got a single millisecond more screentime.

I don't think it stuck the landing, but DW finales almost never do. I did enjoy the Doctor clearing house on post-Time War Gallifrey, it was satisfying to see some long-overdue justice served on a pack of genocidal pricks.
The Sneaky Tiki
Well, I just marathoned it and while it was better than last season, I still wish the show wouldn't drop the ball as often as it does.

Ashildr/Me was a more interesting character than either Capaldi's Doctor or Clara. I dunno if it's because I marathoned the entire season but they kept repeating that whole "Clara acts reckless like the Doctor" and the response "I have a duty of care" thing between them so many times and it got repetitive and boring fast.
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y

I'm pretty sure the Duty of Care line only happens twice, although I could be forgetting one.

The 'Clara becoming the Doctor' thing was actually started last season with Flatliners. I think it mostly worked as an arc but there were definitely a few points where they kind of shoehorned a mention of it in in an obvious way.

I think the real problem is that they'd already did such a shit job of establishing Clara's character in the first two seasons or so that she was kind of a nebulous blob when they got started on it, so they needed to checkpoint it constantly instead of assuming the viewers would remember her as having consistent character traits from episode to episode.
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM

No full season in 2016—just a Christmas special—but the 2017 season will be THE LAST STEVEN MOFFAT SEASON. The creator of Broadchurch, Chris Chibnall, will replace Moffat.
>the creator of Broadchurch, Chris Chibnall
Is that worth celebrating in and of itself?
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That's the opposite of glorious news. Chibnall's the single worst imaginable candidate for the position.

>The creator of Broadchurch, Chris Chibnall

Sort of glossing over some of his other, rather more salient 'accomplishments' there, aren't we?
Crossposting from another forum I post on, where it was suggested that Chibnall might not involve himself so much in the episode-writing and adopt a higher-level editorial oversight approach given his...erm..."less-than-well-received" contributions to the Doctor Who canon (note - said forum prides itself on elevated discourse, so feel free to translate "very cautious" as "FUCK WHY"):

Put me down as very cautious about Chris Chibnall as showrunner. As wise as I think a hands-off approach is given his track record, it could lead to a loss of focus and narrative drift over the course of the series. RTD and The Moff had their supporters and their detractors (and you could easily do a 1:1 straight swap between the two groups) but they both had very distinct editorial styles that easily defined the show. I'm not sure Chibnall has the same gravitas to provide that kind of signature.

I was hoping some other figure would emerge in the last few years of Moffat's reign, since Chibnall was the "default choice" for Moffat's successor from the very beginning. Unfortunately no other writer has stamped their personality on successive scripts the way Moffat did in the RTD years (besides Gatiss, arguably, and he was never going to be showrunner). I think we've all felt that it was high time for Moffat to move on, but I fear this latest move will lead to Doctor Who just cruising along on autopilot until the ratings collapse and it's put back in the shed for another decade.
DudeWithMoney !SFwR6DnH/Y

A hands-off approach like that would be highly atypical for British television, as I understand it.
Yeah, we don't really go for the "writer's room" approach that American shows do, it's usually a couple people writing an entire series. That's do-able in the UK where series are usually 4-8 episodes long, but that's impractical for the sprawling 22-episode seasons US shows get.

That said, Doctor Who is unique amongst British shows in having a "writer's room" setup (its seasons are considerably longer than most other shows on British telly), so a hands-off approach would be perfectly achievable if somewhat unprecedented. Nu!DW was conceived from the very beginning with an unusually "American" setup to ape the cult US shows like Buffy or X-Files that were experiencing strong success on BBC2 in the years prior.
>it's usually a couple people writing an entire series...but that's impractical for the sprawling 22-episode seasons US shows get.
Unless you're J. Michael Stracynski, the crazy freak.

Ah JMS Babylon Five and Real Ghostbusters. Classics.
thatother1dude !!/PKS88+dMMc
Or do the Doc Hammer and Jackson Publick thing two guys write practically everything (and do half the acting), but seasons come years apart.

Though part of that is the blood from a stone funding problem. Doctor Who is still one of the more regular shows BBC puts out. Cripes Sherlock to reference Is about two to three years apart and that is only Three Episodes a Series (Season) and after the special it won't be back again till next year.
Well this is Austerity Britain, we're not exactly made of cash.

One advantage to having incredibly short series is that each episode gets a lot more loving care and attention than your typical American episode. Compare the production value of your average episode of CSI to your average episode of Silent Witness. They're both fundamentally silly police procedurals, but the silly British police procedural just feels "classier" than the silly American police procedural.

Of course it all breaks down when you get your HBOs and your Showtimes and your Netflixes where the shows shrink to British-type lengths and the difference in funding utterly crushes our domestic efforts.
I feel like eventually, there will be Big Finish audios with Peter Capaldi.
That will probably be the only way he will get to star in a story with Chumblies.
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We have our new companion. She reminds me a bit of Lucie Miller in this brief clip.
So when does the new stuff with the new companion start?
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM

The next season, duh.
Talking year here. Last heard the show was going on a year break.
Spring 2017 I think
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM
This upcoming season will be the last for both Steven Moffat and, as announced earlier today, Peter Capaldi.
Damn taking the good with the bad on this one.

Ah well.

And here starts the arguments over the next regeneration.
rasputin_zero !!e9Z+3lbULwW
Mood music from Auntie seems to be "it's time for a lady." I've heard that being the likely reason for picking Chris Chibnall as Moffat's replacement, as despite blighting the franchise with the existence of "Cyberwoman," his stint on Broadchurch at least demonstrates an aptitude for writing characters without Y chromosomes that his predecessor has conspicuously lacked.

Good the fear of The Doctor just becoming another River makes me cringe.

Though I do worry how they'll do this and keep The Doctor being a unique character since we've had a lot of female characters over the years who being a Time Lord or not have been played up as The Doctors equals.

Wonder what age they'd go to. I know some name that have been kicked about but going too famous means you are settling in for a short run Doctor.

Personally I'd am for lower level famous and somewhat quirky but with an acid streak. Harken back to the punchy Doctors.

Side note I vote Peter Capaldi to play Flintheart Glomgold in the new Ducktales so we can have two Scots/Time Lords barking at each other.
*taps mic* ahem... Hayley Atwell.

I think we're done here.
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Yes. I could get behind this Doctor.
I like her doctors too.
Who needs a soinc screwdriver, those conkers will open up all the doors.

Massive stacks and can get into adventures and hold her own. I'd say she's perfect to be the first round of Lady Doctors.
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>Hayley Atwell
>Has large breasts
>Comically scaled large breasts.
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM
Latest rumor going around: Tilda Swinton is being considered for the next Doctor.

Really kinda fucking want.
Nah looks way too much like Matt Smith and seems like kinda a copout going with the androgynous "alien" look.

I like Atwell because she's more action oriented.
Swinton would be very expensive. A one and done to say that they did it before going back to the usual fare.
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'They won't risk a woman Doctor. They want a David Tennant type.'

Kris Marshall

Fucking BOOOOOO!
At least we might finally get the ginger gag.
I don't think it would be a risk if they got someone that could

A. handle multiple seasons
B. Be Fun and Interesting

Heck Donna Noble was a treat doing her bit.
Eh strikes me about the same as we had with Matt Smith. Nobody being trilled with him as we only had those early photos of him in dark clothes looking very broody.

As for lady things I'd rather just have the deal with that later after being thoroughly planned. Because doing it now under pressure its just going to either be short and expensive or a slow motion train wreck.
Mr. Stone !zWb42fBPMM
The Thirteenth Doctor has been revealed: Jodie Whittaker, best known for her work on “Broadchurch” and her role in “Attack the Block”, will take over the TARDIS.

Appropriate joke: https://twitter.com/flashboy/status/886608190695145472
Too bad she comes packaged with Chris Chibnall, the man who showran four seasons of awful dreck on Torchwood.
Pretty good pick.
rasputin_zero !!e9Z+3lbULwW
I was actually surprised how "Doctor-y" she looked in the promo. It's an intangible thing to nail, so I'm definitely optimistic. I've fallen off the Who bandwagon for a while and this is a good excuse to catch up.

On the other hand, Chibnall is also responsible for critically-acclaimed "Nordic Noir" series Broadchurch, which suggests he's learnt lessons from the age of "Cyberwoman."

His recent Who scripts have been shit, too.
I'll wait and see. Tuned out 12th Doctor since nothing in that early run enthralled me. Only thing good we got IMO was a reissue of the Light Up Time Control Tardis.

Even first season of Broadchurch, the back half is a bit of a mess.
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Words I dread when they talk about building the new doctor. River Song. Any bit of that and its over.
Its a shame how Doctor Who went completely to shit.

Honestly series should not be dragged out forever for money, they should be allowed to die naturally.
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All they needed was quality control, and someone (who is either the creator or a close friend) to be a visionaire in control. Someone with a vision of what the show should be, overseeing the show. But no. And fans don't care, cause "next episode might be good tho".

One good thing is there is a YTP channel that does nothing but DH poops.
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The next Doctor Who will be a black dude. I mean suppose after making DW a woman it was the only way they could top it.
Wonder how many more Doctors there will be before they stop trying to keep the series alive.
You know they'll do a real reboot before we have shit like "The 38th Doctor". Hell; once all the actors for the original 7 are dead, you know they'll hire lookalikes and just do new stories with those versions of the Doctor. I'm genuinely surprised they haven't already done it with the First.
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They could do a british remake/followup and the doctor would still end up black.